DrWho Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 In my case, I've found that the weakest is the recordings themselves 99%+ of the time. Considering that your percentage is so high, would it be fair to ask if the playback system used when drawing those conclusions somehow might be the culprit and not the music itself? For years it has been said on this forum that a good speaker reveals the flaws in bad music While there are many merits to that idea, I have found several cases where the speaker has been the culprit (or something else about the system). Take for instance, the Khorn. All of the arguments being made here about horns are true for the Khorn, and there is no shortage of people making the same "garbage in / garbage out" justification about hearing bad sound. It's been a lingering question of mine whether or not the speaker or the music should be considered "at fault" - especially knowing there was no way the artists would ever release something they thought sounded bad when they heard it in the studio...When the Jubilee came around, I realized a lot of that "bad music" all of a sudden started sounding very good on the Jubilee. It is not hard to make an objective argument for the superiority of the Jubilee - and I bring that up because here we have an example of the previous speaker being the culprit. The Jubilee (like anything in the audio world) is not without its compromises - thus why I have a signature reminding myself of that. Anyways, if we are going to claim that 99% of the music sounds like crap through our systems, then I would suggest one of two things must be true: Wrong expectations of the playback system. 99% of the world has different listening tastes. I would be embarrassed to say that 99% of the music sounds bad on my system - and you're making it a point of pride and justification for your decisions. I certainly don't mean for this to be confrontational - although I know that's how I come off most times and I'm working on improving my writing skills. I just don't get how we can share in our understanding of theory or our experiences if you're going to turn around and say the music I enjoy and have great emotional connection with is somehow crap. I'm over here having a blast with a much lessor system - and isn't that the point of it all? All the techno babble is just a means to a very subjective / emotional end. I just like good music and do whatever it takes with my system to maximize that enjoyment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornukopia Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 Thinking about mid range wondering what is more accurate horns or cones If you own a set of Klipsch then you hear this every time you listen to them. You can read about it below. Best regards Moray James. http://www.elpee.inf...hVervorming.pdf Here are two snapshots from the Paul W. Klipsch paper in the link provided by Moray James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 (edited) In my case, I've found that the weakest is the recordings themselves 99%+ of the time. Considering that your percentage is so high, would it be fair to ask if the playback system used when drawing those conclusions somehow might be the culprit and not the music itself?...For years it has been said on this forum that a good speaker reveals the flaws in bad music While there are many merits to that idea, I have found several cases where the speaker has been the culprit (or something else about the system). ...When the Jubilee came around, I realized a lot of that "bad music" all of a sudden started sounding very good on the Jubilee. It is not hard to make an objective argument for the superiority of the Jubilee - and I bring that up because here we have an example of the previous speaker being the culprit. The Jubilee (like anything in the audio world) is not without its compromises - thus why I have a signature reminding myself of that. Anyways, if we are going to claim that 99% of the music sounds like crap through our systems, then I would suggest one of two things must be true: Wrong expectations of the playback system. 99% of the world has different listening tastes. I would be embarrassed to say that 99% of the music sounds bad on my system - and you're making it a point of pride and justification for your decisions. I certainly don't mean for this to be confrontational - although I know that's how I come off most times and I'm working on improving my writing skills. I just don't get how we can share in our understanding of theory or our experiences if you're going to turn around and say the music I enjoy and have great emotional connection with is somehow crap. I'm over here having a blast with a much lessor system - and isn't that the point of it all? All the techno babble is just a means to a very subjective / emotional end. I just like good music and do whatever it takes with my system to maximize that enjoyment. Well, I guess that I should be more careful in my expressions of this type. What I meant to say is that 99% of the time, I'm not aware of the potentially spectacular performance levels of the Jubs (and the other 5 speakers in my 5.2 setup) for realistic performance. Most music that I play sounds very good, but there are a few recorded discs (mostly in 24/96 on Blu-Ray) and downloaded high-resolution music files that are truly outstanding, even to the point that I'm still amazed by what they can do. That's what I meant to say. Sorry if I communicated the wrong impression. Many of the discs that have been recommended to me as audiophile demonstration discs aren't in the class of the best discs that I've found. So my comment that you quoted above is meant to point to the potential for greatly increased fidelity of recordings, like nothing that I've experienced before. This is a message of a bright future, not a condemnation of the present state of the art. There are only a handful of recordings that show up the deficiencies of my setup - and that's okay. I've arrived at a state after six and a half years of building up the system where I feel satisfied. Good timing as it turns out. I try to share my lessons learned so others can avoid them. The general level of affluence seems to be declining for younger generations (Millennials and Gen-Xers in this country). I believe that much is yet to be done in the business of hi-fi to reduce costs but to continue to increase overall fidelity. I also understand the possible context of your comments about having "very few good recordings" based on our past discussions. I agree with your comments, since I was dissatisfied with my Jubs playing all kinds of music for at least three years before I began to get the setup in good enough shape to play almost anything on them and still sound good. It shouldn't be that difficult to get them sounding good, IMHO. It's my objective to help to reduce this timeline for others that may be interested in the type of system that I've collected. Chris Edited July 9, 2014 by Chris A 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 I'm not Mallette, but I know he would agree when I give the stamp of TRVTH to ChrisA. Formerly known as cask. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipsch Employees Chief bonehead Posted July 9, 2014 Klipsch Employees Share Posted July 9, 2014 In my case, I've found that the weakest is the recordings themselves 99%+ of the time. Considering that your percentage is so high, would it be fair to ask if the playback system used when drawing those conclusions somehow might be the culprit and not the music itself? For years it has been said on this forum that a good speaker reveals the flaws in bad music While there are many merits to that idea, I have found several cases where the speaker has been the culprit (or something else about the system). Take for instance, the Khorn. All of the arguments being made here about horns are true for the Khorn, and there is no shortage of people making the same "garbage in / garbage out" justification about hearing bad sound. It's been a lingering question of mine whether or not the speaker or the music should be considered "at fault" - especially knowing there was no way the artists would ever release something they thought sounded bad when they heard it in the studio...When the Jubilee came around, I realized a lot of that "bad music" all of a sudden started sounding very good on the Jubilee. It is not hard to make an objective argument for the superiority of the Jubilee - and I bring that up because here we have an example of the previous speaker being the culprit. The Jubilee (like anything in the audio world) is not without its compromises - thus why I have a signature reminding myself of that. Anyways, if we are going to claim that 99% of the music sounds like crap through our systems, then I would suggest one of two things must be true: Wrong expectations of the playback system. 99% of the world has different listening tastes. I would be embarrassed to say that 99% of the music sounds bad on my system - and you're making it a point of pride and justification for your decisions. I certainly don't mean for this to be confrontational - although I know that's how I come off most times and I'm working on improving my writing skills. I just don't get how we can share in our understanding of theory or our experiences if you're going to turn around and say the music I enjoy and have great emotional connection with is somehow crap. I'm over here having a blast with a much lessor system - and isn't that the point of it all? All the techno babble is just a means to a very subjective / emotional end.I just like good music and do whatever it takes with my system to maximize that enjoyment. I like to hear good music and have to make it sound good on my system but most of it, dare I say 99%, is definitely not reference and recorded like crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipsch Employees Chief bonehead Posted July 9, 2014 Klipsch Employees Share Posted July 9, 2014 "I assume that's a rhetorical question. Perhaps you should start your own thread on the specifics of what you clearly object to in your quoted statement."Are you serious? You're talking authoritatively on this topic, and you seem to have no problem fielding questions from others. So, if one agrees, they can stay in the thread, but it they disagree, they should start their own thread
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