Test Driving Used Khorns....What to do?

[Eddie 500]

If I was gonna buy a 25 yr old pair of khorns from a stranger what would I need to check prior to handing over the cash?

 

Of course I have to hear 'em..............but what else?

 

How do I know the crossovers are working correctly?    etc. etc. etc.

[Budman]

tweeters should be a concern, everything else should be fine.

Edited March 10, 2015 by Budman

[Schu]

If all drivers are producing sound, that is about all you can do. You will never know if anything is really specification.

The good news is that every Single thing on that speaker is rebuildable or upgradable.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Schu

[eth2]

I sent this to Eddie earlier. Please chime in.

1, Pull one of the leads off the horn. and then listen to the tweeter.

2. Listen to each horn.

3. Look at the general condition of the crossovers - any leaks, or other deterioration?

4. If possible open the doghouse and check the general condition of the woofer. Owner will probably not look kindly on this.

5. Look at the general condition of the wiring.

6. look for general issues with the lamination. Is the veneer separating? Any signs of water damage?

7. LISTEN TO THEM! Do they sound as you would expect?

[garyrc]

Put your ear up against the grille where the tweeter is to make sure it's working.

 

Take some recordings you are familiar with to play over the Khorns.  Weigh your response.  The Khorns are very revealing of both music and some kinds of distortion.  Play something soft and something loud.

 

You will probably want to replace the 25 year caps, although my original set still sounded good after that length of time.  If you don't want to DIY, Crites can do it for a fee.

[Schu]

take your favorite music with you over there and have a listen...

[toolz]

After your listening tests, take a screwdriver and an ohmmeter, remove both leads for each speaker connected at the crossover and take a resistance measurement. Put the leads back.  Measure both tweeters, both squawkers and both woofers.  Write the resistance readings down for each set and compare.  The resistance readings for each pair of drivers should close within 1 ohm or so, if not most likely a replacement speaker was used.  Opening the doghouse should be only done if there is an issue with the woofers.  Depending on the vintage, removing the doghouse door can get tricky and messy depending on the type of material used on the door seal.          

[Fjd]

There are already many good observations here regarding listening to the speakers. 

 

Overall cosmetics should be evident to you from taking a close look at the speakers (as eth2 recommends in #6) and if they are clean and original under the tophat (easy to look in since it is open and you don't need tools to take apart), I suspect the woofer would be the same since it is sealed off (unless of course the bottom half sat in water  ). 

 

Only you will know what cosmetic condition you will be happy bringing into your home and at what price you feel comfortable from that perspective.

 

It is good to confirm that all drivers are working. Probably the primary issue that I've run across a lot with Klipsch speakers over the years is where a tweeter or both were blown (in most instances I seemed to run across blown tweeters in the models that used the K77 vs. other tweeters).  I have not encountered blown mid-drivers or blown woofers.

 

However, while I suspect that there are some people that might let you tear apart their speakers, I can't say that I know anyone that will let a stranger bring in tools and start tearing apart their speakers. 

 

Another thing that I've noticed is that not everyone can put their ear to the grill and tell if the tweeters are working either.

 

What should work if you run into either situation to verify that the tweeters are working, is to bring a cardboard tube, such as the cardboard tube from a toilet paper roll and put one end on the grill where the tweeter is located and your ear to the other end.  I have not found a person yet that cannot hear a working tweeter using this method.

 

 

 

1, Pull one of the leads off the horn. and then listen to the tweeter.
2. Listen to each horn.

 

 

Put your ear up against the grille where the tweeter is to make sure it's working.

 

[WMcD]

My advice.

1) Make sure they are K-Horns and not the Speakerlab SK version or a home made pair. This should be easy because the SL look home made.

2) I would think that the owner is not going to let you do too much tinkering, I would not. But he should help you pull them away from the wall to look for the serial number paper tag. It will show a serial number an inspected by, and has a patent notice. It is official looking! Inspect the mid and tweeter, see below.

3) Ask if he has any paperwork such as a bill of sale or invoice to him. Nice to have but not dispositive.

4) Do make up a bill of sale to you. All you need is a piece of paper titled "Bill of Sale" saying Klipschhorns, model number on the tag, serial numbers xxx and xxy and a date, sold by (name of seller-address) to (name of buyer -address), and price. This should be acceptable to him. It protects you in the off chance they are stolen or there is any issue of title. You can show a good faith purchase, and is just good business practice. Handwritten is fine. This is the lawyer in me.

5) As said by another, bring a test record you like. Seller probably has some too but make yourself happy. I like Telarc like Symphonic Star Trek. Light jazz or "girl with a guitar" is not enough for my testing. You get the idea. Smile.

6) Do use the amp's balance control to listen to each individually. It is surprising difficult to ascertain what is going on with one speaker when there is a similar one sounding off. If the woofer or mid is not working, you should be able to hear it, right away.

7) The crossovers should look "factory" rather than home made. The components are so basic and bullet proof I would not worry.

8) The mid driver is robust and in all the years here I think we have never heard of a failure. It should say PWK on it.

9) The woofer is also robust. I think the seller is not going to let you open the hatch. I would not do so unless there is some issue.

10) If there is a component which fails, because it is delicate, it is the tweeter. Looking in the back, check that it says Klipsch. Take along a roll from paper towel or toilet paper to serve as an improvise stethoscope to let you focus on it. These are only reproducing above 6000 Hz which is the upper octave of our hearing. So all you are going to hear is some tinny, scratchy sound.

11) Go into this with an assumption that the seller is dealing in good faith. It is sort of "trust but verify" because it is a fair amount of money.

12) Bring a truck and blankets, an maybe a hand cart. The tops come off for shipment.

WMcD

Edited March 10, 2015 by William F. Gil McDermott

[TasDom]

^^ Great suggestions

[garyrc]

The woofer is also robust. I think the seller is not going to let you open the hatch. I would not do so unless there is some issue.

 

The only Khorn woofer I've ever heard of that blew was blown by a salesman in an audio store!  He had turned it way, way up, and had turned up the bass control as well.

[richieb]

Put your ear up against the grille where the tweeter is to make sure it's working.

 

Take some recordings you are familiar with to play over the Khorns.  Weigh your response.  The Khorns are very revealing of both music and some kinds of distortion.  Play something soft and something loud.

 

You will probably want to replace the 25 year caps, although my original set still sounded good after that length of time.  If you don't want to DIY, Crites can do it for a fee.

Yeah, check the tweets for sure. I travelled 500 miles to buy some very nice Belles but the seller was in the middle of a move and I had no opportunity to listen and at the time wasn't aware of how to check the drivers. Get em home fire em up something just wasn't right. No, no it wasn't; both tweets were shot. It is really hard to tell with your ear to the tweet with the big squaker in the same basic location.

Stuff a towel or something similar in the squak horn which will make it easier to identify tweet life.

[Eddie 500]

After your listening tests, take a screwdriver and an ohmmeter, remove both leads for each speaker connected at the crossover and take a resistance measurement. Put the leads back.  Measure both tweeters, both squawkers and both woofers.  Write the resistance readings down for each set and compare.  The resistance readings for each pair of drivers should close within 1 ohm or so, if not most likely a replacement speaker was used.  Opening the doghouse should be only done if there is an issue with the woofers.  Depending on the vintage, removing the doghouse door can get tricky and messy depending on the type of material used on the door seal.          

I've never done something like this. I don't have an ohmmeter. Can I get one at the local home depot? radio shack just closed near me.

 

And I conduct the test with music playing thru them correct?              Don't flame the noob, pls.

[JJkizak]

I would never ever let anyone disconnect or check my speakers, not even God.

JJK

[001]

as for disconnecting leads... not all k-horns or lascala or belles can do that, only the older ones.  speakers around the late 80's or early 90's the crossover & mid/tweets all had soldered leads, you cant remove them without desoldering the wires.

 

as for the ohm meter testing, if you have never used an ohm meter, or even if you have, i would not EVER let someone go poking around on my crossovers.  & i highly doubt any owner/seller would allow it either, so dont waste your time trying to do that.  go buy a meter if you want to get familiar with how to use it & maybe after you buy them you can play around with that.  but chances are if you look at the speakers & they say PWK on them, they are original or genuine klipsch drivers. 

 

same goes for opening the bass bin door, cant believe it's being suggested you try to do that.  there is no way in heck i would allow anyone with a screwdriver, or ohm meter, anywhere near my k-horns! i didnt expect or even think to do that when i bought mine & wouldnt expect anyone to do it if i ever sell them. 

 

testing the tweeter is pretty easy, the toilet paper tube idea is good but still hard to hear it when the mid squaker is squaking in your face.  easiest way is to use a flat piece of cardboard or other similar thing to simply cover the mid opening, then stick your ear in front of the tweeter, you will easily hear it playing the high notes, unless of course you have a hearing problem.  actually your hand should suffice for blocking 90% of the mid sound.

 

aside from that & some of whats mentioned above, just bring some music you are familiar with, or even rely on what the selller has.  all you are doing is verifying all drivers work, critical listening will be done in your home.  dont be afraid to ask the seller to turn the volume up a bit so you can feel the bass, if there is no popping or "farting" noise from the woofers chances are the speakers as a whole are fine.  cosmetic issues are based on whats acceptable to you & usually will reflect the price. 

 

& whatever you do, dont let the seller persuade you by saying what "new" k-horns cost... this is a common tactic & has nothing to do with the price of 20-30+ year old speakers.  if that comes up,  tell him you have a 1986 ford truck you will sell him for $20 grand... because you know, 2015 ford trucks sell for $40 grand! 

Edited March 11, 2015 by klipschfancf4

[tromprof]

Bought mine from an old lady whose husband had died. She had promptly exiled them to the garage. I was able to verify the drivers worked but they sounded terrible sitting in the middle of the garage. I bought them anyway. I got them home, seated them in good corners, and magic!

If the drivers function you should be ok.

[Max2]

You guys are overthinking this.  You buy K-horns for the cabinet condition and what veneer it has. Of course you want to make sure all drivers play or deduct some from the asking price. Factory Drivers are cheap.  You know the Networks are old and need new caps or totally replaced so that's a gimmee.

[Eddie 500]

Thanks klipschfan. The speakers asking price is what I consider fair market value, and at the top of my budget for khorns actually!

 

Some sellers are nutty with their prices tho.....and as such I wouldn't persue them as my funzarelo.......lol

[eth2]

as for disconnecting leads... not all k-horns or lascala or bells can do that, only the older ones.  around the late 80's or early 90's the crossover & mid/tweets all have soldered leads, you cant remove them.

 

 

same goes for opening the bass bin door, cant believe people are suggesting you try to do that, there is no way in heck i would allow anyone with a screwdriver, or ohm meter, anywhere near my k-horns! i didnt expect or even think to do that when i bought mine & wouldnt expect anyone to do it if i ever sell them. 

 

 

1, My Khorns are newer than that and I can pull a lead off the mids. Not sure what you are talking about here.

2, Depends on the seller. Not everyone is like we are. I opened the bass bin when I bought my LaScalas.

Edited March 11, 2015 by eth2

[wvu80]

& whatever you do, dont let the seller persuade you by saying what "new" k-horns cost... this is a common tactic & has nothing to do with the price of 20-30+ year old speakers. 

 

if that comes up,  tell him you have a 1986 ford truck you will sell him for $20 grand... because you know, 2015 ford trucks sell for $40 grand! 

 

Not only can you get good advice for testing speakers while buying, you also get suggestions for snappy comebacks!  

 

I love this place!