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crouse

Dave's Fastlane fastrac horns?

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I have some mid-range harshness in my La Scalas, which I know is a common complaint. I have been researching new speakers but am also wondering if a change/upgrade to my LSs would make a difference. I came across the daves fastlane site and their fastrac horns. Has anyone put these in La Scalas? And, if so, what difference did you hear? Also, I have Crites CT-125 tweeters and 4500 crossovers in my La Scalas.

Thanks

Edited by crouse

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crouse,

Yes I have Dave's tractix midrange horn in my LaScalas. And yes it did tone down the midrange harshness at higher volume levels.

babadono

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You could also modify/adjust the crossover to bring the level of the mids down a little to help prevent the buzzsaw in your forehead feeling. It can make the whole balance seem better, too.

Bruce

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Crouse,

I've got a pair of Dave's horns in my LaScalas. They sound fabulous and IMO an improvement over the K400 or K401. My take on the sound is that the mids sound more open and airy on Dave's horns.

On the problem of harshness, i think you've got some good advice from Marvel. I'd definitely try dropping the mid output by a few dbs. I've done this before with Khorns and LaScalas. In some rooms they will sound better like this, IMO.

I've also had mid harshness with LaScalas with worn out caps in the crossovers. The problem was helped with fresh caps in the crossovers.

Have used the CT-125 tweeters and Crites Type A 4600 crossovers in Khorns and LaScalas with very pleasing results. Am currently using this configuration in my current LaScalas and the sound is very good.

Interesting enough, in some other rooms i've thought the sound improved by dropping a tap on the mid output. In my current room, the taps are standard and the music sounds balanced and right.

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You could also modify/adjust the crossover to bring the level of the mids down a little to help prevent the buzzsaw in your forehead feeling. It can make the whole balance seem better, too.

Bruce

Would using an EQ to bring down the mids do the same thing?

Thanks

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Would using an EQ to bring down the mids do the same thing?

My initial thought is to say yes, but I don't have an eq in my system. Not necessarily against them, I just don't have any. But that is adding other electronics in the mix. Your crossovers are already there.

Bruce

Edited by Marvel

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"I have some mid-range harshness in my La Scalas ... I have Crites CT-125 tweeters and 4500 crossovers in my La Scalas."

So, now that we know lowering crossover points and changing tweeters doesn't get rid of it ...

Sometimes the problem is caused by compression artifacts in the recording. There isn't much you can do about that. Because of their high sensitivity, horn loaded loaded systems usually make it worse. All that wonderful noise is pushed to the top for your listening pleasure.

If your recordings are generally good, and you're hearing it, then that means you probably listen close to live levels. In that case, the problem is being caused by the stock horn. The throat is extremely narrow and long, and is the epitome of a "bottleneck". The throat overloads and the sound becomes harsh and garbled. There is also a lot of "squeeze", so it can sound somewhat spitty.

Modern film capacitors in conjunction with the stock attenuation settings tend to exacerbate the problem.

Some basic room treatments help too. You have to address the room if it's contributing to the problem.

Edited by DeanG

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You have to address the room if it's contributing to the problem

Hello room........I would like you to behave :mellow:

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"I have some mid-range harshness in my La Scalas ... I have Crites CT-125 tweeters and 4500 crossovers in my La Scalas."

So, now that we know lowering crossover points and changing tweeters doesn't get rid of it ...

Sometimes the problem is caused by compression artifacts in the recording. There isn't much you can do about that. Because of their high sensitivity, horn loaded loaded systems usually make it worse. All that wonderful noise is pushed to the top for your listening pleasure.

If your recordings are generally good, and you're hearing it, then that means you probably listen close to live levels. In that case, the problem is being caused by the stock horn. The throat is extremely narrow and long, and is the epitome of a "bottleneck". The throat overloads and the sound becomes harsh and garbled. There is also a lot of "squeeze", so it can sound somewhat spitty.

Modern film capacitors in conjunction with the stock attenuation settings tend to exacerbate the problem.

Some basic room treatments help too. You have to address the room if it's contributing to the problem.

Only happens on a few recordings. I tend to listen at about 75 to 80 db according to my sound meter. May be simply a matter of the recordings. Dunno. I have a boxed set of Led Zep and the harshness is particularly onerous on Kasmir. I am about to re-do the room, so it may go away after that is finished. I've also got them for sale on the local craigs list, so I may never know. We'll see.

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You have to address the room if it's contributing to the problem

Hello room........I would like you to behave :mellow:

Lol. Reminds me of a classic Honeymooners bit, "Hello, ball."

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Only happens on a few recordings

If it only happens on a few recordings, it's not the horns or the room. Crap in = crap out.

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Only happens on a few recordings

If it only happens on a few recordings, it's not the horns or the room. Crap in = crap out.

I'm finding this to be true as I make my setup incrementally more resolving. Stuff that sounds great in my truck sounds awful at home. Jazz, Classical, and Yes/Dire Straits/Santana sound great on my 2-channel rig though. I'm starting to understand why "audiophiles" listen to a small subset of genres.. :blink:

btw, you can't fix crap.

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A DBX 3BX or 4BX works wonders with marginal sounding recordings ( except for clasic-rap, c-rap).

Years ago I did a small party (in a tent) with a time-alligned system with 8 horn-loaded 15's, 4 horn-loaded 12's for mids, and some nice 2" throat HF drivers. It was tri-amped with about 2KW. Most program material sounded poor at levels above 100mW. With the DBX and Frankie goes to Hollywood it sounded great at 2KW.

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Only happens on a few recordings

If it only happens on a few recordings, it's not the horns or the room. Crap in = crap out.

I'm finding this to be true as I make my setup incrementally more resolving. Stuff that sounds great in my truck sounds awful at home. Jazz, Classical, and Yes/Dire Straits/Santana sound great on my 2-channel rig though. I'm starting to understand why "audiophiles" listen to a small subset of genres.. :blink:

btw, you can't fix crap.

Welcome to the club of sensitive listening. Good ears and good horns make it so.

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I have a set of Daves Fastrac horns in my Cornscala's and they sound wonderful.

What are the components of a Cornscala doc?

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Well, when I got them they were basically the same as a Cornwall except for mid-horns and crossover. I was in heaven, couldn't believe how incredible it sounded. Then, after about 2 years one of them developed a buzz every time a piano hit an F# on my Gershwin CD. It didn't do it on my HT system so I changed (upgraded) my original 1984 vintage tweets to the CT-125's. Surprised to still hear the buzz (could have swore it was the tweeter) and ordered Atlas V5 or 5V (have to look it up) mid drivers (another upgrade) and then had Bob Crites build new crossovers since the Atlas drivers wouldn't work with the old crossovers. Only thing original are the woofers which are fine. Imagine my surprise when changing out the crossovers I find a loose connection (loose screw) where the wire from the mid driver attaches to the crossover. D'oH!! But in the end it was worth it as it has an even bigger soundstage and depth - especially to acoustic guitars and female voices. OMG!!!!!!!!!

They are just about done being broken in now and with my recently rebuilt (by Craig at NOS Valves) Scott 272 powering them I'm back in heaven on Earth, actually my basement. Hope I didn't bore anyone with my ramblings - guess I'm a happy guy.

Edited by Dr Morbius
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"I have some mid-range harshness in my La Scalas ... I have Crites CT-125 tweeters and 4500 crossovers in my La Scalas."

So, now that we know lowering crossover points and changing tweeters doesn't get rid of it ...

Sometimes the problem is caused by compression artifacts in the recording. There isn't much you can do about that. Because of their high sensitivity, horn loaded loaded systems usually make it worse. All that wonderful noise is pushed to the top for your listening pleasure.

If your recordings are generally good, and you're hearing it, then that means you probably listen close to live levels. In that case, the problem is being caused by the stock horn. The throat is extremely narrow and long, and is the epitome of a "bottleneck". The throat overloads and the sound becomes harsh and garbled. There is also a lot of "squeeze", so it can sound somewhat spitty.

Modern film capacitors in conjunction with the stock attenuation settings tend to exacerbate the problem.

Some basic room treatments help too. You have to address the room if it's contributing to the problem.

Only happens on a few recordings. I tend to listen at about 75 to 80 db according to my sound meter. May be simply a matter of the recordings. Dunno. I have a boxed set of Led Zep and the harshness is particularly onerous on Kasmir. I am about to re-do the room, so it may go away after that is finished. I've also got them for sale on the local craigs list, so I may never know. We'll see.

Led Zep imo sound pretty bad. Its probably why I could never really get into them. For me If a band has bad sound its pretty hard for me to like them.

Edited by reference_head

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what about those uber expensive half speed led zep vinyl lp's?

perhaps they have better fidelity.

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