Max2 Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 So many large improvements can be made with the upper Heritage line, it almost doesn't make sense to buy new, unless you are made of money. Even then, K-horns, LaScalas and Belles all need about 3K invested to replace the mid horn. Mid driver, Tweeter and network. If you score a set of K-horns for around 3K and add the mods which puts you at 6K total, might as well buy a pair of new Jubs and call it a day. What? Wait, I can buy a new set of Jubes for 6k? And I can spend 3k on mods for a pair of Ks that probably don't need modding? Where can I get new Jubes for 6k? I suddenly have the upgrade urge again (and it's only been 2 weeks) lol Mark Arent Jubs about 7K a pair? Maybe Im off mark here, but my point was to get the upper an Heritage line somewhat closer to Jub performance the difference in price is not substantial, especially when you are starting with used K-horns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorm Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 Last quote I got on new Jubs were like a little over 3 a piece. Not the best looking, as they are KPT...but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorm Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 Raising the price of the K-Horns will only inflate the used market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted September 3, 2015 Moderators Share Posted September 3, 2015 Trying to kill off a product line so they dont' have to mess with U.S. manufacturing? I heard all the pro and cinema stuff is made in Hope and they are all on the increase, and Heritage is made to order I thought ? To me it would be crazy for them to stop making Heritage, they would lose the claim of longest speaker in the US still in production and all the history the company was built on. Probably just a price increase ? But who knows 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teknoid Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 Anybody know when the last Heritage Line price increase was? Seems to me like they held their pricing stable for quite a while in the face of inflation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max2 Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 (edited) Trying to kill off a product line so they dont' have to mess with U.S. manufacturing? I heard all the pro and cinema stuff is made in Hope and they are all on the increase, and Heritage is made to order I thought ? To me it would be crazy for them to stop making Heritage, they would lose the claim of longest speaker in the US still in production and all the history the company was built on. Probably just a price increase ? But who knows Yeah, I don't see how they can kill the line that made them famous, especially since they're made to order. Although I cant see paying craftsman sitting around with no orders to fill. The problem is the middle class is dying. We are becoming a country of "haves and have nots" and the toys the middle class were able to afford in the past, they just cant anymore. I might also mention that people stepping up and buying new sets of the upper Heritage aren't worried about a price hike. They want brand new and they probably don't even know about a price hike, they just want them ordered with one phone call or one visit to the dealer and them showing up at their doorstep. Edited September 3, 2015 by Max2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyrc Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 (edited) Some people think a product is better if they paid more for it. There are "High End" speakers out there that far less labor intensive to build than a Klipschhorn that cost much more, and the few I have heard sound no better (or worse, partacularly in upper bass attack!). Maybe Klipsch is trying to tap into the "more expensive is better" market. In any case, I think it would be a huge error to discontinue the Khorn. It was also an error to raise the price as much as they did. Edited September 4, 2015 by garyrc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paducah Home Theater Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 They were already pretty expensive, if somebody wants a set, they're still going to buy them. I mean, stuff like F-150's can jump 10% and Ford isn't exactly going to be hurting if you know what I mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceptorman Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 Anybody know when the last Heritage Line price increase was? Seems to me like they held their pricing stable for quite a while in the face of inflation. Good point, how long were they at their previous price? Maybe it was time for a price increase. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Naseum Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 So many large improvements can be made with the upper Heritage line, it almost doesn't make sense to buy new, unless you are made of money. Even then, K-horns, LaScalas and Belles all need about 3K invested to replace the mid horn. Mid driver, Tweeter and network. If you score a set of K-horns for around 3K and add the mods which puts you at 6K total, might as well buy a pair of new Jubs and call it a day. That's what I thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratcobob Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 I may have Gormvestments handle my portfolio. His market timing on buying Khorns seems like it was pretty astute. Insider trading Gorm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyrc Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 (edited) Klipschorn is inherently not really upgradeable. As the old ads used to say "Ho-Hum...another major breakthrough." Dave ?? I thought guys were selling all sorts of upgrades to the drivers, crossovers and so on??? Of course they are. And I am sure some hear a difference and prefer one tweak or the other. However, my 1972 models are accurate to my ears and need nothing. The desire to "upgrade" is that of the equipment head...which I am not. Once happy, I stay that way unless something goes wrong...and that can be fixed. Dave I agree. I listen primarily to orchestral music, classical and modern, as well as a little jazz. Our Khorns are used for critical listening and for movies. With good program material the Klipschorn doesn't need upgrading. I say this as someone who has played in orchestras, been to many orchestra concerts, and used to eat lunch in front of one rehearsing. With bad program material, Khorns may be a little less forgiving than some, but I've never been able to decide whether more forgiving speakers simply veil the warts, or what. I have heard problem recordings on other good systems, and those systems may more veiling, but less vital. On balance, I tend to prefer most of these recordings at home, on Khorns. I have never heard a Blu-ray (of a relatively recent movie) that had bad audio over Khorns with a Belle center. I actually like the sound of the K77F(& M). I'm aware that at least one forum member thinks it sounds like frying bacon, but I've heard bacon frying when close up to, or in, a live orchestra, during brass attacks, etc. I fully realize that measurable improvements could be made, and that a redesign like a Jubilee would measure better, and perhaps sound better, for those who don't mind the huge mid/treble horn. Klipsch evidently doesn't think it is very marketable for home use, I'm guessing because of its appearence. Whether changes retrofitted into the current Klipschorn cabinet would increase my enjoyment is doubtful. Several forum members had a chance to compare Khorns with Palladiums at Hope, and they seemed to prefer the Khorns. Right now I am listening to a SCAD of a RCA Living Stereo recording (made in 1960 and 1961*) over our Khorns, and it is lush and gorgeous ...it's triggering my musical gestalt, as J. Gordon Holt once said his readers who were musicians reported about Khorns. I'm tapping my feet, and bouncing up and down in my desk chair. IMO, that's what counts. * Stokowski Rhapsodies (List, Enesco, Smetana, Wagner) Edited September 4, 2015 by garyrc 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 garyrc, the Jube violates one of PWK's basic tenets: Maximum performance at lowest cost. Further, as you mention, for most of us there is no audible improvement in normal listening rooms as the K'horn is accurate. You are dead on about source quality. The description of K'horns is often "...mercilessly transparent" and they make bad recordings sound exactly what they are. I simply get rid of anything that doesn't sound good on my 'horns. Dave 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Chad Posted September 4, 2015 Administrators Share Posted September 4, 2015 Trying to kill off a product line so they dont' have to mess with U.S. manufacturing? This is so NOT true. As far as I'm aware from what I've heard around here is we are constantly looking for ways to manufacture MORE in the U.S.. As you know we have to keep things close to our chest here and I'm not qualified to talk about particulars anyway. Heritage products got the increase after years and years and years of being the same price. We have to remain in business so we CAN keep things like Heritage line around for another 70 years. These speakers are such iconic investments that the price increases shouldn't phase most. There are so many people that come to us and say things like "I've had my Klipsch speakers that I bought for 30 years, I'm a loyal customer!" To me, that IS loyalty and it's GREAT and it speaks to the quality of our products. But if that person hasn't bought any other of our products in those 30 years, at what point are they no longer considered a current customer, and more of a fan? We remain in business by selling products. So we have to do what we have to do. Ah, capitalism. On the subject of making parts available to purchase easily - I can say we are working on a solution for that. ;-) 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paducah Home Theater Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 (edited) There are so many people that come to us and say things like "I've had my Klipsch speakers that I bought for 30 years, I'm a loyal customer!" To me, that IS loyalty and it's GREAT and it speaks to the quality of our products. But if that person hasn't bought any other of our products in those 30 years, at what point are they no longer considered a current customer, and more of a fan? We remain in business by selling products. So we have to do what we have to do. Well, there's always this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence Edited September 4, 2015 by MetropolisLakeOutfitters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted September 4, 2015 Moderators Share Posted September 4, 2015 Yeah, I don't see how they can kill the line that made them famous, especially since they're made to order. Although I cant see paying craftsman sitting around with no orders to fill. The problem is the middle class is dying. We are becoming a country of "haves and have nots" and the toys the middle class were able to afford in the past, they just cant anymore. From what we have seen it's the same people making every model in Hope, it looks like when there is orders for a Heritage model they make a run of that model and not just that pair. So they are made to order but in a little more efficient way. And your right the middle class is all but gone So we have to do what we have to do. Ah, capitalism. Someone has to pay the bills and there not building speakers for the exercise. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal Blacksmith Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 Chad I guess I am more of a fan than a current customer. My 78 Khorns sound fantastic and I am listening to a modern recording at the moment. The biggest problem from a sales point of view was touched on by you. The 30 year old speakers (unless abused, left in the rain, hit by a natural disaster etc) work just as well as they did new and when cared for, look like new so they don't need replacement. Cars used to change looks every year just so your 3 year old car looked dated and needed replacement to stay up with fashion of the day. When the makers stopped making drastic changes, the cars looked similar for longer so the average age of cars in service went up. For good or ill, Klipsch has a similar problem with the heritage line. Outstanding quality and service life with looks that don't change. While I own about 8 pair of assorted heritage speakers (thus helping to dry up the surplus on the market LOL) I can't USE any more sets of speakers. Collect them, sure but even a "fan" only has so much room. I do want to thank Klipsch for continuing to manufacture them in the U.S. and for maintaining the high quality bar they set so many years ago. I truly hope that Klipsch continues to win new customers and stay in business for the next 100 years at least 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJkizak Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 I am impressed at how long my un finished 1965's have lasted with all of those glue joints and such. I have many old chairs where the glue joints have broken loose. I wonder if they use hot glue on the joints. JJK 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted September 4, 2015 Moderators Share Posted September 4, 2015 Chad I guess I am more of a fan than a current customer. My 78 Khorns sound fantastic and I am listening to a modern recording at the moment. The biggest problem from a sales point of view was touched on by you. The 30 year old speakers (unless abused, left in the rain, hit by a natural disaster etc) work just as well as they did new and when cared for, look like new so they don't need replacement. Cars used to change looks every year just so your 3 year old car looked dated and needed replacement to stay up with fashion of the day. When the makers stopped making drastic changes, the cars looked similar for longer so the average age of cars in service went up. For good or ill, Klipsch has a similar problem with the heritage line. Outstanding quality and service life with looks that don't change. While I own about 8 pair of assorted heritage speakers (thus helping to dry up the surplus on the market LOL) I can't USE any more sets of speakers. Collect them, sure but even a "fan" only has so much room. I do want to thank Klipsch for continuing to manufacture them in the U.S. and for maintaining the high quality bar they set so many years ago. I truly hope that Klipsch continues to win new customers and stay in business for the next 100 years at least Well said Cal, and agree, except for a couple replacable parts that age as expected they have an unbelievable lifespan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyrc Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 (edited) Chad, Although I bought my first Klipsch product 33 years ago (Khorns), I have purchased at least one Klipsch product every 4.7 years since, always new. Every time audio comes up, I recommend Klipsch, including when going under the anesthetic, when the anesthesiologist asked one of those "are you asleep yet?" questions: "What are your hobbies?" Answer: "Audio, I have Klipschornsssss ......." Thanks to Klipsch for so many years of customer satisfaction. Edited September 4, 2015 by garyrc 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.