When Did We Become So Wimpy On The Forum?

[USNRET]

23 minutes ago, USNRET said:

Your point?

 

Could have been

 

But then

so now

and that explains that

[Travis In Austin]

5 hours ago, CECAA850 said:

 

Isn't the first rule of an attorney to never ask for information or a question that they don't already know the answer to?

 

 

I haven't every seen an official HD forum, still haven't.   I have seen one or two official audio manufacturers forum, and they really didn't go anywhere.  But it has been some time.

 

I don't think people understand that this Forum, one operated with no ads, no fees, no costs, if very unusual for a manufacturer.  JBL doesn't have one.  McIntosh doesn't have one.

 

It is a gift horse, yet most of the folks responding here what to stare it in  the mouth.  Many have take it for granted, and that is a very dangerous thing to do.  About 6 or 8 years ago someone who was well liked on the forum, well respected, was told by Amy to shut his trap about something and he tried to lead a revolt and start his own Klipsch Forum touting that people could say anything they wanted on his forum.  He posted a link and Amy let it sit there, and I think 10 or 15 people joined his forum, and it was defunct in a month.

 

I have said many, many times before this is all cyclical, it just keeps rolling back round and round again.  Different people, different things, but still the same. 

 

What is very striking  is that they don't understand that Roy is a man of few words, but what he says carries significant weight.  When he posts something to the effect "I think I can change that" people's ears should perk up, and should realize that if he perceives there is a problem, then there is a problem.  They can sit and fling all they want, but if Roy sees it as a problem it will get dealt with, sooner or later, but it will be dealt with.  People can either address it by having a civilized tone, and carry on a decent conversation, making valid points.  Or they can ***** and moan.    

 

I think it is a pretty simple attitude that would cut through all of this:  If you are not part of solution you are part of the problem. 

[twk123]

26 minutes ago, dtel said:

I don't always post in threads like this but I know Roy and I know what kind of guy he is and had to say something, I am happy to be his friend. Call me whatever, I don't care, being friends with Roy is more important then me being on this forum, plain and simple. I say this from respect, it took me a long time to really get to know him. 

 

For people who don't know Roy here's a quick short idea of what he does when he's not fishing or hanging out with friends and family. 

 

He has done this work for over 30 years, most of it closely with PWK. He has just about any kind of equipment needed to test his designs including an Anechoic Chamber. He has a long history of designing many of the horns and speakers many here listen to, with patents on some designs.    

 

Being lucky enough to spend alot of time with him I can say he is kind of obsessed with getting the most out of every one of his designs, it's a real passion for him.  I know why he get's bothered with some of this and I can say it's not because people want to try different parts. I will not say why because it's not my business to say, here or in pm's.

I have all the respect in the world for Roy and what he has done. I think a lot of the remarks people have on this issue are due to speculation on Klipsch enacting a new codified policy to change the forums and not allow any suggestions of modifying the speakers etc and we have not heard much of a definitive answer as far as what is going on. If this is simply Roy becoming a moderator and be more active in the forum, including stepping in on threads when necessary then I dont really have an issue with that and think its pretty cool one of the head designers of the company is actually interacting with customers. However, if Klipsch is going to overhaul what kind of discussions are allowed here as a policy then I think the longtime members here have a right to speak their minds, especially if we feel it will hurt Klipsch down the road.

[dtel's wife]

9 minutes ago, BigStewMan said:

It must be nice...i’m not so blessed.  Know a lot of people, they all seem to like me; but, few ever seem to reach the “good friend” level.  I must take part of the blame, i’m not the most sociable person that’s ever walked the earth. 

We are not the most sociable people either. We have just been blessed to have some really good friends in our lives...particularly in the last ten years or so. Many of these good friends are people we have met on this forum, others we have met on our travels to Arkansas and other places. I'm lucky enough to call people I went to school with in elementary, Jr. high and high school, very good friends. Yet others, are neighbors we've met through the years. 

[BigStewMan]

4 minutes ago, dtel's wife said:

I'm lucky enough to call people I went to school with in elementary, Jr. high and high school, very good friends

wow, i don’t associate with a single person that I went to school with. there are a few that i would though if the opportunity came up.  I left town and never looked back. Never went to a school reunion. 

[USNRET]

6 minutes ago, BigStewMan said:

wow, i don’t associate with a single person that I went to school with. there are a few that i would though if the opportunity came up.  I left town and never looked back. Never went to a school reunion. 

You should, just for laughs. Weird that I left that town in '73 and when I occasionally go back everyone knows me and I don't recognize anyone.

 

[dtel's wife]

18 minutes ago, twk123 said:

I have all the respect in the world for Roy and what he has done. I think a lot of the remarks people have on this issue are due to speculation on Klipsch enacting a new codified policy to change the forums and not allow any suggestions of modifying the speakers etc and we have not heard much of a definitive answer as far as what is going on. If this is simply Roy becoming a moderator and be more active in the forum, including stepping in on threads when necessary then I dont really have an issue with that and think its pretty cool one of the head designers of the company is actually interacting with customers. However, if Klipsch is going to overhaul what kind of discussions are allowed here as a policy then I think the longtime members here have a right to speak their minds, especially if we feel it will hurt Klipsch down the road.

I think we should all take a deep breath!  We specifically asked Roy to consider becoming a moderator because there is a lot of "snake oil" on this forum. It was not an easy decision for him.

 

Roy worked along side Paul for many years. Roy is always open to suggestions to design better a product. It's what he does for a living with Klipsch. He always strives for the best. It's his promise to PWK. 

 

That being said, based on my interactions with him, he has a very low tolerance for BS "upgrades and mods". That is where his expertise is needed. He's not afraid to admit when he is wrong, or when there may just be a design better than one presented. At the same time, he will be real quick to call BS if that's how he sees it. 

 

I think everyone needs to take a step back and give him time to present his ideas. He deserves that much from us. I do not see the basic format of the forum changing. What I do see is Roy's expertise and guidance leading us in a positive direction when it comes to spending our hard earned dollars on "upgrades and mods". 

 

This is strictly my opinion. 

[USNRET]

[Travis In Austin]

4 hours ago, USNRET said:

Just had to go read that transcript...probably would have been a thing of beauty when listened to in a time / place / mind space some time ago.

 

 

I thought I would be the only one who remembered that.  Where did you find the transcripts?

[anarchist]

2 hours ago, dwilawyer said:

I think it is a pretty simple attitude that would cut through all of this:  If you are not part of solution you are part of the problem. 

 

Cliches are rather simple.  There first needs to be a problem before you can create a solution.  I haven't seen the definition of a problem yet.  I have seen someone take umbrage over semantics.  I have seen that some propose actions that are certain to alienate the community, and, in fact, already have.  And to what purpose? 

 

As I said, Klipsch, or in this case Roy, is free to have an opinion on what he wants the forum to be and can take whatever actions he deems necessary.  The Klipsch community itself will decide whether it was a good idea or not.  My participation here is largely based on the relationships I have established with people over the last 15 years.  During that time I acquired many Klipsch speakers, repaired some speakers, purchased parts for speakers, documented amp upgrades and builds I had performed, and observed as others got deeper in this hobby and purchased Jubilee's and more. Often, I came to discuss non-audio issues and frequently found myself reading threads on new Klipsch offerings or new offerings by other members that enhanced the Klipsch experience.  Really, looking back at all that has happened on this forum, and how much money has been spent...  sorry, I forgot, whats the problem Klipsch is trying to solve?

 

As far as Harley Davidson, facts are facts.  HD is the leading motorcycle manufacturer in the US market owning a 55% share of the US market and a loyal fanbase that companies pay dearly to acquire.  They have taken exactly the opposite approach to the one being proposed here.  As an aside, I don't see these concerns on the PCA forums or the Polk Audio forums.

Have to run.  My wife thinks it is ridiculous I spend so much time on a speaker forum and obsess over audio stuff.

 

Quick PS:  I read above somewhere that Roy is now in charge of the Pro Audio line.  When I spoke to Roy last is was all about the Jubilee.  In any case, went to a movie tonight at the local theater.  Very disappointing audio wise and I don't what garbage is there (my home theater blows it away.)  Largely, we have shunned this theater for the last year because we discovered a theater 30 miles or so away that has just incredible audio.  After the second movie there, I had to look and was thrilled when I saw they were Klipsch Pro speakers - about the size of a Heresy.  6 of them would be nice in my home theater.  I don't know what subs they are using but the sound is just freaking awesome.  Well done, Roy, well done.

[tidmack]

Well, this isn't exactly what I meant when I posted.  However, it seems there were some things people needed to get off their chests! Have a great weekend.

 

Jeff

[USNRET]

9 hours ago, dwilawyer said:

 

 

I thought I would be the only one who remembered that.  Where did you find the transcripts?

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/bob-dylan-gives-press-conference-in-san-francisco-19671214

 

[Zen Traveler]

7 hours ago, anarchist said:

Have to run.  My wife thinks it is ridiculous I spend so much time on a speaker forum and obsess over audio stuff.

At least she doesn't make fun of you for hangin' around being abused by BSrs....Speaking of which, I gather Roy isn't allowed in there--I think I know why.  Anyway, good to see everyone posting and anarchist always seems to put things into an interesting perspective. I hope both he and Roy keep hangin' out and if Chad doesn't see the honeybadger's shadow the open forum will be more interesting as well.

[CECAA850]

Wow.  This thread took on a life of its own overnight.  Time to update my friend an ignore lists.  You know who you are.  Overall though, there were some very funny and also thought provoking posts.

 

Early in the thread Roy indicated he would clarify his position or something to that effect.  I just caught up on the thread and his only other post said "done".  You still there Roy?

 

Too early in the day for a slushie.  Guess I need to get some work done.

[oldtimer]

27 minutes ago, Zen Traveler said:

At least she doesn't make fun of you for hangin' around being abused by BSrs

We went down to the demonstration

To get your fair share of abuse

Singing "We're gonna vent our frustration

If we don't we're gonna blow a fifty amp fuse."

[dtel's wife]

12 minutes ago, CECAA850 said:

Wow.  This thread took on a life of its own overnight.  Time to update my friend an ignore lists.  You know who you are.  Overall though, there were some very funny and also thought provoking posts.

 

Early in the thread Roy indicated he would clarify his position or something to that effect.  I just caught up on the thread and his only other post said "done".  You still there Roy?

 

Too early in the day for a slushie.  Guess I need to get some work done.

He's still here, but I think he has some things he has to attend to this week. 

 

Yes I think they had a good time last night!  

[oldtimer]

Is that you again Shirley?

[Travis In Austin]

16 hours ago, dtel's wife said:

Aren't "sponsoring vendors" those who pay to advertise?

That what they should do, require sponsorship, to Musuem.

 

Thanks for idea Carl.

[Travis In Austin]

10 hours ago, anarchist said:

 

Cliches are rather simple.  There first needs to be a problem before you can create a solution.  I haven't seen the definition of a problem yet.  I have seen someone take umbrage over semantics.  I have seen that some propose actions that are certain to alienate the community, and, in fact, already have.  And to what purpose? 

 

As I said, Klipsch, or in this case Roy, is free to have an opinion on what he wants the forum to be and can take whatever actions he deems necessary.  The Klipsch community itself will decide whether it was a good idea or not.  My participation here is largely based on the relationships I have established with people over the last 15 years.  During that time I acquired many Klipsch speakers, repaired some speakers, purchased parts for speakers, documented amp upgrades and builds I had performed, and observed as others got deeper in this hobby and purchased Jubilee's and more. Often, I came to discuss non-audio issues and frequently found myself reading threads on new Klipsch offerings or new offerings by other members that enhanced the Klipsch experience.  Really, looking back at all that has happened on this forum, and how much money has been spent...  sorry, I forgot, whats the problem Klipsch is trying to solve?

 

As far as Harley Davidson, facts are facts.  HD is the leading motorcycle manufacturer in the US market owning a 55% share of the US market and a loyal fanbase that companies pay dearly to acquire.  They have taken exactly the opposite approach to the one being proposed here.  As an aside, I don't see these concerns on the PCA forums or the Polk Audio forums.

Have to run.  My wife thinks it is ridiculous I spend so much time on a speaker forum and obsess over audio stuff.

 

Quick PS:  I read above somewhere that Roy is now in charge of the Pro Audio line.  When I spoke to Roy last is was all about the Jubilee.  In any case, went to a movie tonight at the local theater.  Very disappointing audio wise and I don't what garbage is there (my home theater blows it away.)  Largely, we have shunned this theater for the last year because we discovered a theater 30 miles or so away that has just incredible audio.  After the second movie there, I had to look and was thrilled when I saw they were Klipsch Pro speakers - about the size of a Heresy.  6 of them would be nice in my home theater.  I don't know what subs they are using but the sound is just freaking awesome.  Well done, Roy, well done.

Well at least you are getting to real facts now instead if of making up your own, like HD has become the largest mc manufacturer in world.  

 

That is one of the problems, by Roy in this thread, and others previously, that you have people posting in the Tech/Mods thread  who are either making up stuff, or peddling snake oil.  

 

As far has HD and modifications, they dont have an official forum.  I will go take a look at the Polk Audio forums and see what is going on in there to see if it might help in there.  If there are any others that anyone is aware of, I would be happy to take a look at them (if they are an official manufacturer's site).

 

You mentioned an official car site as well.  I am really interested in that one.  It will be interesting to see how they deal with aftermarket mods and warranty issues, etc.

 

If you don't see a problem, I can't help you on that.  Some people on here didn't see a problem with discussing race or religion, they either began to understand, or didn't and now they are gone.  But clearly there is a problem.   

 

It may simply be a problem in narrowing down what the concerns are, how to address them, and determining what to do about it, if anything.  Simply saying "there isn't a problem" is counterproductive, using made up facts to try and prove a point, well that's exactly the problem that is perceived by Roy and others.  You sort of made his point for him in an obscure way.

 

I am going to poke around in the tech/mods section this weekend to see if I can educate myself on where some of the problems might be, and if I can, try to think of possible solutions.

 

Maybe one way to deal with it is to have someone with technical knowledge (which mine is limited) to be a dedicated moderator of Tech/Mods.  Someone who can call out bullshit.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Zen Traveler]

45 minutes ago, oldtimer said:

We went down to the demonstration

To get your fair share of abuse

Singing "We're gonna vent our frustration

If we don't we're gonna blow a fifty amp fuse."

Very well said, Mick....My guess the folks on my ignore list are "blowing a fifty amp fuse." LOL and hope your frustrations have calmed down.