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Best imaging I've ever heard? (Thanks Roger!)


Coytee
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I'm in Indianapolis for a couple days and last night made an impromptu visit to Rogers (IndyKlipsch). I was there at the pilgrimage but got to his house late and being tired, left early. Last night I again got there late BUT got a chance to audition some things with just the two of us in the room. (for those that have been there, you might realize it's no small feat to find his place in the dark [:P])

I've gotta say.... I don't think I've ever heard anything like what I heard last night. I presume that most here know that he's got an all LaScala surround system and I think that alone might infer how good it might sound to those that have never been to Rogers.

What I found the most interesting was when we listened to some 2 channel music. I've read him make some comments about his imaging and I've probably read others making some comments about it but last night, I got to experience it first hand and lemme tell you, until you experience it first hand it's hard to comprehend.....very hard.

I thought (knew) Roger was playing the front array of 3 speakers with his center channel turned on. He said it was only the two LaScalas on the sides. To be blunt about it, I thought he was pulling my leg as I could tell the center channel was 'hot' and the side channels were in fact not even turned on. The speakers simply 'disappeared' and were absolutely silent. Up to now, this degree of center focus has only been experienced by me on my Promedia speakers with them 3 feet from my head, off to the sides.

I think he could sense my doubt and suggested that I walk up to the center channel....so I did. Figuring I'd call his bluff, I got up, walked the 12/15 feet to the center speaker and all the while, the sound was simply locked in the middle...up until I got maybe three feet away...then all the sudden the sound whithered away from the center and broadened out to each side, proving him to not be the sneak I was suspecting. I really was expecting to turn around and see him with a big smile, laughing at me for taking the bait. It was THAT 'obvious' that the center channel was playing when in fact...it wasn't.

I've owned LaScalas for 28 years and have never been intentionally (nor accidently) able to make them focus the center image like what I heard last night. It was really incredible and now that I know how great they can do that, I'll have an idea of the goal when I schlep my stuff downstairs and start to tinker on that room.

He's really got a kick hiney system and room. I told him lasts night that he really hit it out of the ballpark. I mean that. Not only is his room (and house) beautiful, it sounds absolutely fantastic and has serious, kick hiney imaging.

Thank you Roger, for your hospitality! [Y]

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Nice write-up Richard. I told you that going to Roger's on a quiet night would be quite an experience. I'm glad you guys had a great time. Roger has spent a great deal of time getting those LSI's lined up PERFECTLY. He taught me about timbre matching back when I thought you had to have a purpose-built center speaker.

Rog likes 'home runs'

See you in a little while, I'm running over to help a friend get started painting her bedroom. She wants to do it herself but I'm 'coaching'.

Then you can learn me some stock market stuff. [;)]

Michael

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Thanks so much Richard (Coytee) of your impression of the room!!

As far as you shaking your head going I KNOW that thing is on.... And walking up to where the center speaker is..( and your right about 2-3 feet from it it just dissapears to the sides) it is spooky!! And everytone does it too.

In stereo mode, with the right material, you just swear the center speaker is just on!

I had a blast..... later I will post more...

I told Richard last night... It really isn't about showing off so much, (OK maybe just a little.. hehehe) But really it is about SHARING the Klipsch "Experience."

When your going through Indy next time Richard, give me a call. We'll do it again!

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Roger did a great job and you can tell ! I have not seen many dedicated Ht but this would be hard to top.

" See you in a little while, I'm running over to help a friend get started painting her bedroom. She wants to do it herself but I'm 'coaching' "

Michael,........Never heard it explained like that before ! [:o][;)]

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Michael,........Never heard it explained like that before ! SurpriseWink

Well, you know me, Mr. Helpful and all...

Richard, thanks for your visit, it was educational although I was a bit woozy from my sleep study last night. Let's do that outdoor PA thing in Knoxville sometime! I appreciate you taking time out to pop up to Indy. Thanks!

Michael

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Mark...

HT: 2008 My Dream La Scala HT System for downstairs is finally done. 7
Split La Scala's, (Timbre DOES matter!) Two Klipsch THX KSW 120 subs,
with the KA 1000 Amp, with the Velodyne SMS-1, Bass management system,
with 2 THX series KS-525's as side surrounds. WOW! Dedicated 17' x 30'
room, 106" Daylite screen, with the Infocus 7210 DLP Projector. Sunfire
Theater Grand IV, Sunfire Signature series 200 x 7 amp. OK, It IS
Klipsch Nirvana, for me. The ticket booth is open, and the popcorn
machine works too! Dim the lights, on with the show!!

Some DVD's, cd's, and the music channel on Comcast.

So the pro line of La Scala's with the k 43 woofers, split with the tops up a bit..

Same original networks.. AL-3's

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He's really got a kick hiney system and room. I told him lasts night that he really hit it out of the ballpark. I mean that. Not only is his room (and house) beautiful, it sounds absolutely fantastic and has serious, kick hiney imaging.

Thank you Roger, for your hospital

I agree with your assesment of Roger's setup, it gorgeous aesthetically as well as sonically, even without the Hurd Mini-Sub, LOL.

It was Roger who inspired me to put K-43's in my LaScalas, which improve the imaging, since the high BL of that woofer tips the reponse up a bit near the 300-400 mark and does a better handoff to the K400. I didn't go so far as to Laser align mine to the sweet spot like he did, but they are well aimed.

So if you can imagine my 2-ch setup in a 13x29 room, except with ALL Horn bass (punchier, not lower), then you know thet sonic nirvana exists in MI as well besides at Bob Riff's house. LOL.

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It was Roger who inspired me to put K-43's in my LaScalas, which improve the imaging, since the high BL of that woofer tips the reponse up a bit near the 300-400 mark and does a better handoff to the K400. I didn't go so far as to Laser align mine to the sweet spot like he did, but they are well aimed.


So the K-43s make that much difference?

I always had good imaging with the La Scalas and the JubScala conversion improved it further. When I go into the room and have forgotten whether the system's set to 5-channel stereo or straight 2-channel, I sometimes have to go up to the center speaker to be sure.

As for the laser aligning, that's a really good idea. You don't have to run back and forth across the room with a tape measure in your hand and you can get both speakers lined up more precisely (and matching each other) than you ever could with a tape. The surround speakers in particular would have been really difficult to line up any other way.
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I owned La Scalas for over 15 years before I found out they could do that. The trick for me was to space them out to 18 feet or so and toe them in at 45 degrees (like Klipschorns) and sit at the crosshairs of the pair. Then it unbelieveable.

Must be someting about horns, because recently I purchased a pair of Heresy II, sat them on their risers at 7 feet from me, sat in their crosshairs in an equilateral triangle (less toe-in than with Klipschorns) and they imaged nearly as well too.

I can't count the number of people who swear the center is on! When I audition the system to people, I often start with an A cappella track, just to make sure they are seated in the sweet spot, and ask them where the voi9ce came from. They all point to the center speaker and I know I have them hooked.

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As I statd many times and hearing it again this year at the Pilgrimage, I believe hands down that Roger has one of the best listening rooms I have ever heard and probably one of the best in all of Indianapolis. I love the fact that it is still live on the side as the klipsch rooms seem way way to dead to me to be honest real scenario music rooms. Also, I to thought that there was a center speaker till roger pulled the screen and I walked up and put my ear near them.

As with the minibeast, I think that though is the one thing Roger's system could not do. I explained to Roger what happened as I will explain again. Roger's home theater is basically a true theater room in which no expense was spared. I mean it is done simply right, all the appropriate sound deadening, the asthetics etc. From what I remember he decoupled the ceiling with the 1st floor as his system is in the basement. When Hurd and DrWho brought over the minibeast, I didn't even realize it till I was talking to Mark Blanchard (A Klipsch Engineer) and suddening I felt the floor trembling. I remember Roger had kw-120 which are no joke but I thought no possible way the kw-120 can do that. And then I realized, oh the minibeast is here. I think Roger was even impressed with the minibeast so much that he was asking me how much it would cost to make something like that (oops cats out of the bag roger!)

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With my powered center channel I do not have to angle anything, measure anything, or sit in the sweet spot with a safety belt. I can walk around to any point in the room and hear everything from the proper direction. Yes it is a "forced scenario" and there are acoustic anomolies in the non-acoustically modified ordinary living room. I have had great confidence since 1965 in what PWK and Bell Labs have recommended.

JJK

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I've spent a lot of "quality time" sitting in Roger's theater over the past two years. One of the things that struck me almost immediately was that his theater does have the best imaging and sound stage I have ever witnessed in both 2-channel and surround operation. Like many folks, I usually use my own theater as my comparitor because that is the room with which I am most familiar. Before coming to Roger's last year, I had thought that my own theater was about as good as I was going to witness because I have been so satistied with how our rrom came out. But after witnessing Roger's I'm a bit more humble now. LOL Roger's room is much larger than mine and it allows you to sit further back fom the front array so I believe the sound has more time to blend properly; a distinct and irreversable problem with smaller rooms such as mine.

Roger: You will remember that I sat next to you in your theater a few weeks ago and told you exactly what Richard said to you in his post above that your room has the best imaging and sound stage I have heard yet. I really meant that. You have indeed hit a home run! Great work, Sir! And yes Dean, Cindy being there does help a lot! [:D] -Glenn

My only gripe about your theater, Roger: Fifi (below) could use a bit more sun! LOL

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I loved Michaels beast of a sub, but to be honest by Sunday, when we had both of them tuned in... I like having Both of the THX 120's better. (And no not just saying that cause that is what I have..)

To be fair to him too... There may be several reasons..(they blended better with my La Scala's but they should...I have spent a lot of time getting them to do so.) Room placement in my room was not 100% ideal for his beast.. mine is...for the THX 120 speakers.

Amazingly, according to doc who spent a lot of time then testing with graphs... They were very very much alike.

I was curious as to the cost of a such a beast yes..... Just looking at the thing ans seeing the craftsmanship Michael Hurd put into it you gotta say to yourself whoa.....and smile when everything is on and running properly.

Both subs blended so well at times your going is it on??? Of course at the right time.. right material... There is no denial... Your gonna feel it!! hehehehehe

In either case, "Flight of the Phoenix" In the opening crash scene where your just living it live in the plane with either sub cranked up your stomach gets turned inside out, and at levels some of you wanted at the pilgrimage... OMG...... You could of sworn you were indeed there! It was, and is,... INSANE!!

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Glen... I will mention that to "Fifi" the "Lingerie Model" turned hostess with the mostess, ticket girl LOL.

"Fifi" never argues with anyone, always seems to have a smile on her face, and is eager to please, quite nice on the eyes...and never asks for anything in return. (I am sure this next line will kill me at some point...) She (Almost) would make the perfect wife!! hahahahaha...

Then again, I have Cindy.. I have the perfect wife for me anyhow!! (Whew, saved myself there.....LOL)

Fifi's outfit was one of those outfits Cindy wore when we first dated.. I think it is a "St Johns" knit outfit. Very classy, and looks just perfect on the manaquin.

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