W27 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I'm not a fan of any of the new stuff. Even the name bothers me. Reference premier? If it's the Premier, shouldn't it be better quality than the current reference line? They should have named it something completely different. I think its a little offensive to current reference owners. I didn't read the 40 pages before this, so I'm sure a lot of this has been said. A reasonably priced 3 way tower would have been nice. At the RF7II price, they should be able to add a mid. I'm sure they sell a whole lot more lower end best buy model stuff. Business wise it makes more sense to appeal the masses, but I have no interest. How is it offensive to current Reference owners? These Reference Premiere models look like they should out perform the current Ref ii models(RF-7 aside as no successor has been revealed). Maybe I'm wrong. I didn't see too much info on them yet. To me they looked like they made the cheap best buy series look like the reference. For instance, the center channel speakers look like RC64II's. At half the price I highly doubt they're better. Plus they're calling them Reference Premier, so in my mind they should be a step up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattSER Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 The Best Buy "Reference" series IS exactly what you are describing. They're merely the old Icon series dressed up in Reference colors. This Reference Premier series is a direct successor to the Reference II line. The center you mentioned(the RP-450c) is half the price of the RC-64 because it is NOT the RC-64's successor. It's more likely meant to replace the RC-62. There have been no successors named for the RF-7, RC-64, or RB-81. However, the RP-280 looks to be an upgrade for our current RF-82ii (RP-260 = RF-62ii, etc...) So what I'm trying to say is, aside from the largest of each type of speaker, the Reference Premier series looks to be a proper replacement for the outgoing, high quality Ref ii series. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 If it's the Premier, shouldn't it be better quality than the current reference line Maybe it will be, just because its lower cost doesn't necessarily mean it will be less quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heritage_Head Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) The Best Buy "Reference" series IS exactly what you are describing. They're merely the old Icon series dressed up in Reference colors. This Reference Premier series is a direct successor to the Reference II line. The center you mentioned(the RP-450c) is half the price of the RC-64 because it is NOT the RC-64's successor. It's more likely meant to replace the RC-62. There have been no successors named for the RF-7, RC-64, or RB-81. However, the RP-280 looks to be an upgrade for our current RF-82ii (RP-260 = RF-62ii, etc...) So what I'm trying to say is, aside from the largest of each type of speaker, the Reference Premier series looks to be a proper replacement for the outgoing, high quality Ref ii series. Thats assuming that they do indeed sound better than the reference ii line . Imo its probably more of an update than an upgrade (just a guess!). But I'm a huge fan of the reference ii series. I owned a ton of them and the reference 1 line ( at least 15 or so different models). And now my family and friends have reference . I hope these do show up somewhere I can see and hear them. Chad I'm in st paul mn 55127 area. Can you point me to a dealer that will have these please. Edited January 7, 2015 by Cinema_head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 If it's the Premier, shouldn't it be better quality than the current reference lineMaybe it will be, just because its lower cost doesn't necessarily mean it will be less quality. That's a good point... http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/177403-linkwitz-orions-beaten-behringer-what.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eth2 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) All the time in the world to chill when you are listening to your new dual eight inch Reference loudspeakers but Heritage lovers may not share your point of view So, the crux of what you have been spouting on about boils down to something like, "I don't like these new products they are announcing, so they are going to crash and burn!" Because that's how you are coming off. It's perfectly OK to not be into a product or product type because of your personal preference. It's also OK to state your opinion on that matter. But you keep this "sky is falling"/"PWK is spinning in his grave" crap going and going and it's looking a bit absurd, and it gets very old to be honest. CHAD Moray has the right to express his opinions, just as anyone else. He makes valid points, from the perspective of an audiophile, and not from the perspective of an accountant. I have learned a great deal from him and modified very good speakers resulting in excellent speakers. If everyone here was a "Homer" it would be a dull place. With all due respect, you need to be careful that your comments, given your position, do not thwart/chill comments which do not comport with the corporate line. Edited January 7, 2015 by eth2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USNRET Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 If everyone here was a "Homer" it would be a dull placeCan you say "Emo Lounge" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted January 7, 2015 Author Moderators Share Posted January 7, 2015 How is it offensive to current Reference owners? These Reference Premiere models look like they should out perform the current Ref ii models(RF-7 aside as no successor has been revealed). I agree. I own, and have owned a ton of Reference speakers. Klipsch could call the new line Klipsch Platinum Series and it wouldn't change how my Reference Speakers sound. From what I can see, the new series does have some improvements over the current Reference II Series. Only time will tell if we will be able to hear those differences. I've already contacted several "local" dealers to see if / when they will have any of the Premiere Series available for demo. One dealer has already replied but he has not received any yet. Can you point me to a dealer that will have these please. It's just one click and a few phone calls / emails away. CHAD Moray has the right to express his opinions, just as anyone else. He makes valid points, from the perspective of an audiophile, and not from the perspective of an accountant. I have learned a great deal from him and modified very good speakers resulting in excellent speakers. Moray is a great asset to this community. He is very knowledgeable, especially in the area of KLF and CF Series. I think the issue with Chad was that Moray did paint a pretty gloom and doom picture (in several posts) that this will be the end of Klipsch...it's all downhill from here type of statements. IMO, that's just silliness, ESPECIALLY when we haven't even heard what these speakers sound like. We haven't even heard if there have been improvements to the crossovers. Is it mere marketing on Klipsch or are there some significant improvements in the design? That will be revealed once many have had a chance to hear them with our own ears. I'm sure Chad would not have become so defensive if there were only one statement but there were quite a few and as others have mentioned, it was getting a bit old. With all due respect, you need to be careful that your comments, given your position, do not thwart/chill comments which do not comport with the corporate line. I don't believe Chad expects everyone to like the new product. That is an impossible task. And there's nothing wrong with stating what you don't like about them. I think it goes back to, "It's not what you say, but how you say it that matters.". I guess people have different ways of offering criticism and expressing themselves. Plus it doesn't help that we are reading words on a screen instead of being able to hear inflection and watch body language. All of that changes how the message is received as well. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted January 7, 2015 Author Moderators Share Posted January 7, 2015 Maybe it will be, just because its lower cost doesn't necessarily mean it will be less quality. The new line isn't lower, it's actually higher cost. Check out a few pages back where I posted a comparison of the pricing. As stated, the new centers are not the replacement of the RC-64 (thus the reason for the lower cost). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelandKlipsch Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) The new items look interesting but nothing on here I would replace my THX Ultra 2 speakers with in my theater. I'd like an option for THX ultra 2 Atmos in wall speaker for the fielding in the future that would be the only future purchase I could think of. Edited January 7, 2015 by MichaelandKlipsch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Between Heritage & the Pro/Cinema Line, Klipsch is still producing all I could ever dream about... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappydue Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 The new items look interesting but nothing on here I would replace my THX Ultra 2 speakers with in my theater. I'd like an option for THX ultra 2 Atmos in wall speaker for the fielding in the future that would be the only future purchase I could think of.cinema!!!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brahmzy Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 When I first saw the new ones I thought they looked really cool / space agey. Now I look at them and see kind of a rubbery/plastics look to them. Not necessarily a look I'd care for in my living room. My RF-7II's gloss veneer has a serious look of class about it. I think I'll have to see em in person. And maybe the flagship stuff will receive different finish treatment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prerich Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Between Heritage & the Pro/Cinema Line, Klipsch is still producing all I could ever dream about... I'd add Palladium to that list myself - but yes, Heritage and Pro/Cinema satisfies my itch very well!!! I hate to say this but I just might have hit the wall.....I'm.....satisfied?!!!!!! I can't believe it!!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattSER Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 If it's the Premier, shouldn't it be better quality than the current reference line Maybe it will be, just because its lower cost doesn't necessarily mean it will be less quality. The cost is actually higher. Somebody did a complete breakdown earlier in the thread. ex. The RP-280 is $1350/pr. $150 more than the outgoing RF-82ii. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted January 7, 2015 Author Moderators Share Posted January 7, 2015 Price Comparison (although the RC-64ii doesn't have an exact comparable model) RF-82ii - $600 each (plus 20% off with code) RP-280F - $675 each RF-62ii - $500 each (plus 20% off with code) RP-260F - $525 each RF-52ii - $375 each (plus 20% off with code) RP-250F - $400 each RC-64ii - $1399 RP-450C - $650 RP-440C - (Link on website is broken) RC-52ii - $369 (plus 20% off with code) RP-250C - $450 RB-61ii - $549.99 (plus 20% off with code) RP-160M - $600 pair RB-51ii - $419 pair (plus 20% off with code) RP-150M - $500 pair RS-52ii - $425 each (plus 20% off with code) RP-250S - $450 each RS-42ii - $290 each (plus 20% off with code) RP-240S - $325 each Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prerich Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) I've already stated that I think the line will do well. Klipsch will sell a lot of these products. There's no foreseeable failure in them. What I do believe Moray is trying to convey is the upscale models are not receiving a lot of attention as of late. Just like the gap in earnings in the U.S. there's also a wide gap between the high end and mid-high end (almost to the point that the mid doesn't exist anymore). You have your big boys (Magico, Accapella, YG Acoustics, and the like), the next level (Legacy, Dynaudio, B&W), your indies (which can compete with the Next level guys except they don't turn out as many speakers due to production facilities and labor), and then you have the usual suspects (which range from HTIB - to some down right good speakers). A company gets to a point where it realizes that it can no longer be all things to all people. Klipsch has speakers that will compete in all of these "divisions" or classes. The Palladium and Heritages are for the big boy/next level class. The Heritages also compete in the indie class due to fact that they are now custom. However the trend at Klipsch is moving into the usual suspects range - that's where your profit margins are at. Klipsch, Polk, and Def Tech have done well to stay above the fray, but its catching up to all of them. Infinity still exist - but it appears to be invisible, JBL has focused on its professional lines. Everyone is looking for their sweet spot and I believe this is what Moray James is really trying to say. I'd really like to know how many Palladium speakers have been sold since their introduction? How many new Heritage? I can see both sides of this camp. Moray is expressing how he feels as an audiophile, while Klipsch is looking at the big picture which has a bottom line....make that crop (that means make money). I made a statement earlier about how long will the current Palladium and Heritage lines last in this type of environment, especially when your real money makers are at much lower price point. Edited January 7, 2015 by prerich 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Chad Posted January 7, 2015 Administrators Share Posted January 7, 2015 Chad I'm in st paul mn 55127 area. Can you point me to a dealer that will have these please. We have a dealer locator at http://www.klipsch.com/dealers. I plugged your zip in and chose 50mi radius and found these. I'm not sure which will be carrying them but you should call them and make sure that they will be (ask them to if they say no, in other words). CHAD Moray has the right to express his opinions, just as anyone else. He makes valid points, from the perspective of an audiophile, and not from the perspective of an accountant. I have learned a great deal from him and modified very good speakers resulting in excellent speakers. If everyone here was a "Homer" it would be a dull place. With all due respect, you need to be careful that your comments, given your position, do not thwart/chill comments which do not comport with the corporate line. If you read my post, you'd note that I said the very same thing about having the right to express an opinion. I personally don't care if someone wants to trash our products, if they've had a chance to see/hear them in person. I also don't care if a certain product type (i.e., HT separates) is not someone's cup of tea. That's all good. People can say what they want. They should also recognize they have no idea what we have planned for other lines in the future. I'm not discounting Moray's contributions to the forum in other topics, however all I ever see from him lately is this sky is falling stuff and it gets old -- so I can express MY opinion to that point, no? This is the last thing I'm gonna say on this. Let's move on. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eth2 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) Chad I'm in st paul mn 55127 area. Can you point me to a dealer that will have these please.We have a dealer locator at http://www.klipsch.com/dealers. I plugged your zip in and chose 50mi radius and found these. I'm not sure which will be carrying them but you should call them and make sure that they will be (ask them to if they say no, in other words). CHAD Moray has the right to express his opinions, just as anyone else. He makes valid points, from the perspective of an audiophile, and not from the perspective of an accountant. I have learned a great deal from him and modified very good speakers resulting in excellent speakers. If everyone here was a "Homer" it would be a dull place. With all due respect, you need to be careful that your comments, given your position, do not thwart/chill comments which do not comport with the corporate line.If you read my post, you'd note that I said the very same thing about having the right to express an opinion. I personally don't care if someone wants to trash our products, if they've had a chance to see/hear them in person. I also don't care if a certain product type (i.e., HT separates) is not someone's cup of tea. That's all good. People can say what they want. They should also recognize they have no idea what we have planned for other lines in the future. I'm not discounting Moray's contributions to the forum in other topics, however all I ever see from him lately is this sky is falling stuff and it gets old -- so I can express MY opinion to that point, no? This is the last thing I'm gonna say on this. Let's move on. I believe it depends on whether you see yourself as primarily a forum member or primarily a representative of Klipsch. I am not sure you can be both. As a former manager, I could not be one of the gang, and the manager. I had to know where the line was, and it is a hard line to draw. Also, it is different to offer an opinion and criticize another. Once again, your position makes this a difficult line to draw. As for a lack of future knowledge, we can only know what we know, and comment on what we know. "Let's move on." Edited January 7, 2015 by Chad (removed duplicate quote) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prerich Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Chad, question....is the Atmos speaker an add-on? If not, will an add-on be offered? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.