Administrators Chad Posted May 6, 2015 Administrators Share Posted May 6, 2015 These things happen in cycles over the history of most forums. It'll come back around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Three rules to keeping an orderly discussion forum: 1. No politics or religion 2. No profanity 3. Be polite What Klispch seems to forget is that this generation that so avidly supports their products was steeped in freedom of speech and expressed frank, diverse and strident opinions. We fought that war in Viet Nam in the jungles AND in the streets of this country. Every member here merits deeper respect than Klipsch seems willing to offer. Whether intentional or not - this petulant corralling is a bit of an affront. Yes, Klipsch has earned our loyalty with their products - but does Klipsch respect or even understand the character of this select customer base? Treating us like children at recess is not very respectful - with all due regard. Humanity grows from debate whether intellectual or confrontational. We all now know not to look for that here on these forums and Klipsch is losing some of the best of us for being so myopic. I do wonder how Paul Klipsch would feel. The internet is full of places where one could go to yell at other folks and argue about such things. We don't mind civil arguments/debates. On the contrary, it spurs conversation. If you think we don't respect our forum members, you are mistaken. Many of you have no idea why the thread in issue was moved since you cannot now see the posts which immediately preceded the thread's relocation. I am one of the members who likes to argue about politics, and it would be fine by me if everyone wanted to argue. However, without fail, at some point, there will be a participant or two who do not have very thick skin. At some point, verbal hostility seems to erupt. It was getting to that point. The thread was rightly moved. We can argue about whether the thinner-skinned people ought to behave differently (like don't participate in threads they don't like), but the fact is this: They are going to react the way they do. That the reaction might be inappropriate does not change anything from Klipsch's perspective. Once hostility begins to ensue, it's time to end it. I see no problem with that at all. They don't want to spend their time figuring out who's right and taking sides, nor should they. It's unfortunate in some respects, but it makes perfect sense in others. If I was hosting a forum in connection with my business, I would do the same. I would not tolerate discussion that devolves into insults or threats. Those of you who were around saw that the thread, though political, was tolerated for quite a long time. Naturally, however, the conversation took the predictable turn, and it had to go. It wasn't due to the topic so much as it was the way the discussion devolved. C'est la vie, but that's the way it goes.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted May 6, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) I think the forum may have started off as a marketing tool and took on it's own life growing bigger than ever expected. ? If I had to guess it's still somewhat a marketing tool but not always a great one, just depends on how new people are treated. It looks like most new people are greeted very well, but on rare occasion not so much. Really everyone has read at times things that are really not in Klipsch best interest in any way, but it is never covered up or deleted. They have very few rules considering the amount of people here and a crazy amount of topics and opinion's. Is it that hard to follow the few rules they actually have ? Then to whine about it at the same time doing there best to wiggle around the rules at every chance. I have tried to stay out of most of this, somewhat because it usually works itself out but for some reason it has become worse and ongoing to the point of some leaving, this is sad. If you have a problem being at the least respectful something's wrong, profanity, politics and religion should be easy. If you have a problem with the 3 simple rules fine you have the right, but don't whine when it's changed or worse. It's 3 simple rules, it does not say you need to agree or like a post or the person posting, giving a different opinion or a reason why you disagree is expected really, but with respect for the other opinion, yours may be wrong who knows ? Sorry but I just got tired of all the rudeness, excuses and whining, it reminds me of when our 3 girls were small, cat fighting for no reason. Reply how ever you want, but you know it's unnecessary. If you like to argue just to argue find another place to do that it's getting old here. Edited May 6, 2015 by dtel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I dunno, counselor. The rules seem ambiguous insofar as they say different things in the same sentence: "NOTE: Topics covering sensitive issues such as race, religion, or politics have no place here and will likely be locked by moderators at their discretion (or by the admin's discretion) moving forward as of 2/20/15." Not that I'm complaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarsear Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Moderation is about moderating, not limiting. The website has shut down major subjects as taboo. In this way it somewhat reminds me of how schools now conduct discipline. The finger point and a bang bang is now deemed equivalent to a machine gun and the 4th grader gets suspended. Et voila. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I think it may have started off as a marketing tool and took on it's own life growing bigger than ever expected. ? If I had to guess it's still somewhat a marketing tool but not always a great one, just depends on how new people are treated. It looks like most new people are greeted very well, but on rare occasion not so much.... This Forum probably reached it's heyday prior to Facebook and Texting becoming so popular...Fwiw, I made my comments earlier about how good Klipsch posters are for sales and customer service whereas in the old days you had to walk in and talk with a salesman and if you had a problem you would call Klipsch CS line--Nowadays people do "searches" on their phones and find the answers they need or suits their purposes....There's probobly just as many people who come up with AVSForum on their searches for answers as they do here because of foot/click traffic--dunno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) Moderation is about moderating, not limiting. The website has shut down major subjects as taboo. In this way it somewhat reminds me of how schools now conduct discipline. The finger point and a bang bang is now deemed equivalent to a machine gun and the 4th grader gets suspended. Et voila. Fwiw, I think you are drawing the wrong analogy--This is a speaker forum with expressed rules. Insofar as equating it to what I gather you are referring to as 'corporal punishment," That really seems like something a parent should have some say in if they want it happening at school--Not many parents want a stranger hitting their kid. Edited May 6, 2015 by tkdamerica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Topics to stay away from are guidelines. The listed topics are most likely to become controversial, heated and personal which is the real reason threads get locked, more so than the particular subject matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muel Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I dunno, counselor. The rules seem ambiguous insofar as they say different things in the same sentence: "NOTE: Topics covering sensitive issues such as race, religion, or politics have no place here and will likely be locked by moderators at their discretion (or by the admin's discretion) moving forward as of 2/20/15." Not that I'm complaining. I'm assuming the legal department at Klipsch has some say here. If you are getting into the area of anything to do with protected classes (Race, religion, disability, sexual orientation, familial status etc...) you are on thin ice as a company. This is the litigious age in which we live. It would be interesting to hear views on this from members of legal backgrounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Topics to stay away from are guidelines. The listed topics are most likely to become controversial, heated and personal which is the real reason threads get locked, more so than the particular subject matter. Of course....That's why I try to stay away from them. I dunno, counselor. The rules seem ambiguous insofar as they say different things in the same sentence: "NOTE: Topics covering sensitive issues such as race, religion, or politics have no place here and will likely be locked by moderators at their discretion (or by the admin's discretion) moving forward as of 2/20/15." Not that I'm complaining. I'm assuming the legal department at Klipsch has some say here. If you are getting into the area of anything to do with protected classes (Race, religion, disability, sexual orientation, familial status etc...) you are on thin ice as a company. This is the litigious age in which we live. It would be interesting to hear views on this from members of legal backgrounds. Not a lawyer but along with legal issues, my guess is for the same reason they don't recommend which AVRs or Amps to drive their speakers--Don't want to alienate anyone in the buying public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I think the forum may have started off as a marketing tool and took on it's own life growing bigger than ever expected. ? Dammit, Elden, I was NEVER any marketing tool... Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I think the forum may have started off as a marketing tool and took on it's own life growing bigger than ever expected. ? Dammit, Elden, I was NEVER any marketing tool... Dave Just a regular tool? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Capitalist tool, I am. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyrc Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I dunno, counselor. The rules seem ambiguous insofar as they say different things in the same sentence: "NOTE: Topics covering sensitive issues such as race, religion, or politics have no place here and will likely be locked by moderators at their discretion (or by the admin's discretion) moving forward as of 2/20/15." Not that I'm complaining. I'm assuming the legal department at Klipsch has some say here. If you are getting into the area of anything to do with protected classes (Race, religion, disability, sexual orientation, familial status etc...) you are on thin ice as a company. This is the litigious age in which we live. It would be interesting to hear views on this from members of legal backgrounds. If that's the problem, why couldn't Klipsch simply post a disclaimer, the way Blu-ray companies do on every disc that invollves commentary, interviews, etc.? "The opinions expressed on this forum are those of the participants, and don't necessarily represent those of Klipsch, Inc., or any of its subsidiaries, stockholders, or associated companies." It's unlikely that a primo film director, writer, or star is going to be told to hold in their opinions when making such a disc. Why should we, the loyal (sometimes repeat, sometimes many tines over) customers of Klipsch? When personal insults occur, they are recognized as such by most readers, can be commented on, or PMs with suggestions can be sent, by those who are the targets, as well as by anyone else There is an automatic censor that changes profanity in to something cryptic and bland, so we don't have to worry about that. It used to change PWK's favorite word, but those days are over, thank goodness. I really don't think we need to be protected from one another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted May 6, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) I think the forum may have started off as a marketing tool and took on it's own life growing bigger than ever expected. ? Dammit, Elden, I was NEVER any marketing tool... Dave Sure you were, just not for what klipsch is selling. I can say this, you did a great job of marketing yourself before you met your wife, she is cool and just has a great attitude. I hope she attends other gatherings, I should have talked with her more last time instead of just floating around, you did well. Now Carl and Thad, I think there single and just won't say it, maby we could get them bring the wives (if there real ) on the next trip, that would be nice. Edited May 6, 2015 by dtel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Now Carl and Thad, I think there single and just won't say it, maby we could get them bring the wives We actually talked about her going next year. I have a brother that wants to come as well. We'll have to figure out something to do with the house Rottie though. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssh Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I've been grading senior essays for the past couple of days. Anything been going on? SSH 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Nope. Just the usual routine. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebse2a3 Posted May 6, 2015 Author Share Posted May 6, 2015 I think the forum may have started off as a marketing tool and took on it's own life growing bigger than ever expected. ? If I had to guess it's still somewhat a marketing tool but not always a great one, just depends on how new people are treated. It looks like most new people are greeted very well, but on rare occasion not so much. Really everyone has read at times things that are really not in Klipsch best interest in any way, but it is never covered up or deleted. They have very few rules considering the amount of people here and a crazy amount of topics and opinion's. Is it that hard to follow the few rules they actually have ? Then to whine about it at the same time doing there best to wiggle around the rules at every chance. I have tried to stay out of most of this, somewhat because it usually works itself out but for some reason it has become worse and ongoing to the point of some leaving, this is sad. If you have a problem being at the least respectful something's wrong, profanity, politics and religion should be easy. If you have a problem with the 3 simple rules fine you have the right, but don't whine when it's changed or worse. It's 3 simple rules, it does not say you need to agree or like a post or the person posting, giving a different opinion or a reason why you disagree is expected really, but with respect for the other opinion, yours may be wrong who knows ? Sorry but I just got tired of all the rudeness, excuses and whining, it reminds me of when our 3 girls were small, cat fighting for no reason. Reply how ever you want, but you know it's unnecessary. If you like to argue just to argue find another place to do that it's getting old here. Man this makes so much common sense....!!!! Best post today on this subject IMO..!!! miketn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted May 7, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 7, 2015 Three rules to keeping an orderly discussion forum: 1. No politics or religion 2. No profanity 3. Be polite What Klispch seems to forget is that this generation that so avidly supports their products was steeped in freedom of speech and expressed frank, diverse and strident opinions. We fought that war in Viet Nam in the jungles AND in the streets of this country. Every member here merits deeper respect than Klipsch seems willing to offer. Whether intentional or not - this petulant corralling is a bit of an affront. Yes, Klipsch has earned our loyalty with their products - but does Klipsch respect or even understand the character of this select customer base? Treating us like children at recess is not very respectful - with all due regard. Humanity grows from debate whether intellectual or confrontational. We all now know not to look for that here on these forums and Klipsch is losing some of the best of us for being so myopic. I do wonder how Paul Klipsch would feel. I would ask The Chief Bonehead, or Dr. Hunter. I have only seen one reference to politics and PMK, when he dispelled the myth that he developed the LS for the the gungubernatorial campaogn me mentioned that the kidded the candidate after he lost the election and said things might have turned differently if he had used his speakers. One think for sure, if PMK was on this forum you couldn't make some flippant remark and not expect your *** to be handed to you. If you have read his interviews, especially the Bruce Edgar one recently reposted, he had citations in hand from peer reviewed journals and other publications. My thinking is that there would be a whole lot more question asking, and a lot less people makeing statements about what was in the news. It would be focused on audio, speaker design, FM midulation, railroads, Chile, ballastics, oil and gas exploration and why The Cardinal was going to beat Cal next season and would be in the Rose Bowl. So ignore the rules? Renegotiate the rules. Debate over the the war you mention was in the streets, the schools, the cities, and it was protected by the 1st Amendment, speech here isn't protected, nor is it at your place of employment. As I mentiobed before, I think they should bring back that hidden forum where politics could be discussed because it appears so many people need an outlet apparently cannot control themselves. Travis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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