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I completely agree.

With respect to the op I won't answer any more questions in this thread. Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

This is the matching center: https://www.klipsch.com/products/klipsch-reference-center-channel-speakers#r-25c

Welcome to the forum and please enjoy the speakers that your father left you. I will second a lot of what TWK posted above and I am a fan of the Bob Crites upgrade to vintage Klipsch speakers. There is no need for you to rush into doing anything, in the meanwhile you can enjoy the speakers as they are. Bob Crites is a very nice approachable man, who will gladly help you decide what is best for you to do as far as bringing the speakers back up to spec. On the back of the speaker should be a tag with the seial number of the speakers, the folks here will gladly decode it for you, along with the crossover type that TWK mentioned. The serial number may also be printed into the back of the speaker along the top of the frame. The Crossover upgrade from Bob is a drop in and connect the wires, type of thing, very easy. Bob will make suggestions given your budget. Don't be afraid to ask questions, the folks here at the forum are very helpful. It makes us proud to get a classic pair of Klipsch speakers back up and running as they should.

He'll be storing those for awhile at that price.

225 8 Ten Years After - I'M GOING HOME (Swing In 1969) - 00:00 Blue Cheer -Piece of mind '69 (Psychedelic Trip) 07:19 Love Sculpture ' Sabre Dance - hits ago go - 1969 14:32 Amon Duul II- Between The Eyes (1972) - 18:23 Colosseum - Valentyne Suite - Live - Montreux (1969) - 24:32 Dark - In The Sky -Very Rare footage 1971 39:22 Wishbone Ash The King Will Come Live 1976 43:42 Iron Butterfly - Butterfly Bleu - Live, 1971 50:08 Beck Bogert & Appice - Superstition - Live 1973 1:10:13 Atomic Rooster - I can't take no more (Beat-Club 1971) - 1:14:41 Steamhammer - Junior's Wailing Live 1:27:30 13th Floor Elevators Roller Coaster 1:31:07 Pink Floyd - Set The Controls For The Heart Of The Sun Live '72 - 1:36:27 Rush - La Villa Strangiato at Pinkpop 1979 - 1:45:35 TEN YEARS AFTER - Spoonful (1968) - 1:52:53 Vanilla Fudge You Keep Me Hanging On - 2:00:10 Wishbone Ash - Warrior - Live 1973 - 2:04:27

Offensively I think both teams played excellent ball. It was the best game of the series so far, if you like watching team ball and execution. Lots of screens, cuts, drives and so many beautiful passes from both teams. That game last night exemplified why we're watching Cleveland and Golden State, and not Houston vs Boston. It was really a shame that one team had to lose. As an added plus, it was a close game that wasn't decided by officiating. When Durant hit that 3 from the exact same spot where he won Game 3 last year, I just burst out laughing. Total deja vu.

I am listening to this video between jobs i am working on

Yep. You csn stick a fork in Cleveland. The western conference finals were more entertaining than this.

SpeakOn, product of Lichtenstein = good. Five way binding posts, product of China = less good. 😊

“What is Active Bi-Amping/Tri-Amping?” Active bi-amping uses one amplifier for low frequencies and another for mid-to-high frequencies—per audio channel. Tri-amping adds one more amplifier for a 3-way system tweeter. This is done via the use of an active crossover unit which is inserted between the preamplifier and power amplifiers. “What are the advantages of active bi-amping/tri-amping?” It provides much greater driver control than a passive crossover/full-range-loaded amplifier configurations. It provides a better load for your amplifiers to drive, and an effective gain in each amplifier’s effective output. It will provide lower amplifier-originated intermodulation distortion (IMD). It provides much greater protection of your tweeter/midrange drivers under clipping/overload conditions. It provides the ability to use less expensive amplifier designs for each driver. It provides for time alignment of drivers within a single speaker (a “must have” capability) It provides for better crossover performance in both amplitude AND phase in the crossover region for smoother crossover performance, including more stable soundstage imaging vs. frequency. It provides stability of crossover performance relative to passive crossover drift during and immediately after under high-load speaker output conditions, i.e., it maintains electrical output linearity under heavy load conditions. It requires lower-quality wire/connectors than a similarly configured passive crossover/full-range amplifier configuration. It allows on-the-fly changes in crossover frequency, EQ and channel gain settings to support changes in your setup configuration, i.e., facilitating the fine-tuning use of tools like Room EQ Wizard [REW], replacing individual drivers, speaker position changes, and adding channels for playback (2.0, 5.1, 7.1, etc.). “What are the disadvantages of active bi-amping/tri-amping?” It requires two/three power amplifier channels per speaker (with associated wires/connectors). It requires an active crossover unit. “What is an ‘active crossover’?” An active crossover provides separation of frequencies of the incoming pre-amplifier output signals, breaking each upstream channel into two (bi-amping) or three (tri-amping) downstream channels: a woofer channel and mid-range/tweeter channel). It provides higher-quality equalization (“EQ”) capability for each channel. Digital crossovers typically provide for delay to allow for time alignment of the drivers within a single speaker. (This is a similar function to an AV Processor that time aligns speaker-to-speaker in a 5.1/7.1 array.) See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_crossover#Active “Do I need to disconnect my speakers’ passive crossovers from my drivers?" Yes. At least the woofer (or low frequency driver) must be disconnected from the passive crossover to permit bi-amping. If your speakers are 3-way (i.e., woofer, midrange, tweeter in each cabinet), then you may retain the passive crossover between the midrange and the tweeter if using bi-amping (…but for tri-amping, all drivers must be disconnected from the passive crossover networks) Can I use ‘passive bi-amping’?” Passive bi-amping does not bring the benefits of active bi-amping, only the disadvantages of extra cables and connectors. Generally, it is not worth the expense of the extra amplifier. In particular, passive bi-amping does not provide for delay adjustment or filter/EQ parameter flexibility. What active crossover brands/units should I use? Many manufacturers make DSP crossovers, including ElectroVoice (Dx38, DC-One), dBX (except the lowest priced DriveRack...which I don't recommend), Yamaha (SP2060), Ashly Protea, Behringer DCX2496 (...avoid this one, too...), Xilica (XP and XD series models), Lake, DEQX, etc. Prices go from $230(US) to many thousands of dollars. There are also lower-cost alternatives, such as miniDSP 2x4 HD and 4x10 HD (avoid the miniDSP "2x4" without the "HD" designation.) Price is generally commensurate with sonic performance. More recently, there are automotive DSP crossovers of lower overall quality and correspondingly low price. In general, I don't recommend these for horn-loaded loudspeakers. There are bundled units with power amplifiers, such as the FusionAmp from Hypex (class D amplifier), and various PA amplifiers from Crown and other companies. These tend to be hit-or-miss propositions. In general, these DSP amplifiers are noisy and/or lack sufficient amplifier fidelity that most home hi-fi enthusiasts tend to want/use. I would ask questions from users on this forum, and the exact type of loudspeakers they used them with (i.e., lower sensitivity vs. higher sensitivity) and the application domain (home hi-fi or commercial PA duty) before investing in these. Analog active crossovers are also available, but lack useful delay, EQ and effective limiting. I don't recommend them for horn-loaded loudspeakers since DSP crossovers of quality can be had for about the same price. Have I seen active crossovers used in configurations other than an active crossover box? Probably--the "powered subwoofer" channel found on most AV Receivers/Processors is a limited example of a for-purpose active crossover channel (i.e., mono bass channel). Usual features include gain control (at the integrated subwoofer/power amplifier unit), user selectable crossover frequencies, and sometimes GEQ/PEQ (graphical and parametric equalizer) filters built into the AVR/AVP. Delay adjustment for each speaker channel is usually included in the AVR processor functionality to correct for speaker distance room placement variances. Additionally, an "Audyssey"-like feature on some AVRs/AVPs features a built-in real-time analyzer (RTA) to help the user set up their speakers in a room environment. (16 Nov. 2010 edit) Can I use a 2-in, 4-out processor (like the EV Dx38) to Tri-amp my three-way speakers? Yes: if you disconnect two of the three speaker drivers from their passive crossovers, then connect the tweeter and (usually) midrange driver to the 2-in, 4-out processor, leaving the last (usually woofer) channel connected to one amplifier, and the other two outputs from the active crossover connect to the inputs of two other amplifier channels, then you can tri-amp your speakers. Note that this will take three amplifier channels per speaker. If you are like many here, finding extra amplifiers to drive your speakers in tri-amp mode is usually not a big issue. Note that you will not have the flexibility to change the crossover frequency of the woofer to the midrange, nor be able to EQ the woofer channel with the active crossover, but you will still be able to use the active crossover to EQ the most important portions of the spectrum and digitally delay the other two drivers in order to time-align your speakers. Some Klipsch models (e.g., Heresy, Cornwall) have a long midrange horn and a direct radiator woofer. This means the the driver with longest delay -- the midrange driver -- will stay connected to the original passive crossovers, and the other two driver channels (tweeter and woofer) can be digitally delayed by the active crossover to time-align to the midrange. EDIT: 14 Nov 2016-- New users of active crossovers looking for more detail on how to install them into the setups can refer to this thread on using Xilica active crossovers: _______________________________________________________________________ EDIT: 14 Nov 2016-- Users of active crossovers seeking to set their parametric equalization filters (PEQs) easily and rapidly will be interested in using Room EQ Wizard (REW) to generate and optimize those semi-automatically. A link to a tutorial thread on that subject can be found here: Chris

I've decided to pull the trigger on a center channel. I have a pair of R-28F's and I've been thinking about an RC-62 center. Problem is I cant figure out for the life of me what cones match my R-28F's for color, is it the RC-62 or the RC-62 II's?

Now what? So yeah, these speakers were my father’s late 70s/early 80s ( not 100% sure on the year) La Scalas. Right now I have a very basic home theater surround sound set-up. I am not experienced in this high end of audiophile-ness. I want to use them obviously but I want to know basically would it be better to ditch the surround sound and go with a 2.1 set-up for the tv and music? Or keep my surround intact (cheap compared to these, Polk setup + sub) and use the La Scalas as the Front L and R? Will those other speakers be so bad in comparison that it would be better to stay two channel with the La Scalas? Also, my AV receiver is a Yamaha RX-V385. Will there be problems there? Again forgive my ignorance and hopefully I don’t get too much of a hard time for asking these basic questions. Below is some info. The room is a small/moderate room with high ceiling. Like I said, will be used as TV speakers + music. Yamaha RX-V385 receiver. I don’t mind “investing” in a proper set-up for a home system, however, I certainly would never acquire La Scalas other than inheriting them like I did if that makes sense. Basically I would never have paid for these speakers new as $2-4K/speaker would be an insane amount for me personally to pay for anything. However, I am willing to sink $500-$1000 in order to upgrade where I can and after that slowly upgrade from there when I can. Thanks in advance.

Can't believe I did this one... I, like I suppose many here, have been tinkering on my cars for (in my case) about 42 years. If we go back to minibikes, dirtbikes and taking care of mowers... maybe pushing 50 years. Tune ups, brake jobs, timing chains, valve jobs total engine/transmission disassembly (on the dirt bikes).... you get the idea. Today, I still do all my fixing, along with taking care of my industrial backhoe that I've now owned for nearing 20 years. (bad thing with the hoe is the tools get larger, parts get heavier (and much harder to procure) and of course... the cost goes up quickly) Something has been amiss in the electrical system ....really, ever since I bought the machine. Alternator checks out just fine but over time (perhaps because of low usage) the batteries (plural since it's happened over the time of ownership with various batteries) the batteries just lose their ability to hold a charge and crank the engine over. Bummer too because with a fresh battery, the engine starts in what seems to be about a 3/4 of a single revolution... it really starts "right now" when it's fed good power. (Perkins diesel) Long prelude to give some background to my stupidity alert... by the way.... if anyone cares to chime in with your own stupidity you are welcome to or, if you wish, you can pile up on me... I can take it....and frankly, deserve it. So I've created the habit of jump starting the machine. I've done it over the years, dozens and dozens and dozens of time.... Other day, pull car, check terminals... put cables on. Put cables on other end and find an interesting splash of sparks. What the ...??? Look at my connections and everything is fine. Machine fired right up (which in hindsight frankly, confuses me a bit) 2-days later, wife wanted some mulch mobilized so went to put it into front bucket....had to jump start machine. Check cables... put on.... another splash of sparks??? What the heck? Look at cables and again, all is fine. Put cables on.... and the car slowly dies. ??? Not once but TWICE I stood there looking at the ground wire and connected the hot to it, cross wiring the cables from the car battery to the hoe battery. Twice.... let that sink in. Twice AFTER the sparks. Twice, AFTER I looked at them to make sure everything was ok. TWICE Such a dumbazz.... Anyone got a tube amp you want me to tinker with after this story...I'm feeling lucky!!!!????

Hello to all of my Klipsch brothers and sisters! This is my first post although I have been perusing the site for some time. Before I get to my main Q, let me tell you a little about me so you can understand me a little better: I am a live sound engineer and have a very solid knowledge of audio gear (mostly in the pro sound world) as well as acoustics (but no formal schooling in the matter) and electrical components / mods / repairs / etc.. I am also a prowd owner of Klipsch speakers, buying my first 6x Klipsch KSB1.1's brand new right when they were getting replaced by the SB line, to use for my surround setup (I know they made center/rear speakers using similar components, but I bought all the same model to preserve consistency across all channels since different models have different sizes and driver counts, and because I was getting a great deal on them!), around 2008ish. After eventually adding a subwoofer (Hsu 10" model) and a couple more 1.1's used, and going thru a few different drive systems (from 4 channels of Soundcraftsmen PA5001 w/ a shure analog and technics digital surround processor back in the day to a Marantz 6.1 receiver to a Yamaha aventage RX-A1040 which is what I currently have, with 4x ksb1.1's flown around sides and back, and three in front for L/C/R). I was "that guy" who went into the Bose store years ago and sat in on the "Demo Room" they had set up, then when I came out and they asked me what do I think, I told them I could hear the speakers fatiguing and distorting toward the end! They asked me what I normally listen to, and when I told them what I do and what I have, the "sales guy" admitted that their products will probably not suit me!!! So to my Question: I am now a proud home owner (well I share one common wall with a couple of older folk who cant appreciate their side of the duplex vibrating) so I cant exactly jam how I would like, or turn up a movie to real-life-action often, but I like to have the headroom!!! I have been using these KSB 1.1's for a long time now and I still love them (although I find it very strange that the pink noise blasts from the Yamaha sound different in each speaker, I found it was in either the amp and/or room acoustics as I tried swapping boxes on one channel and they do sound the same). Luckily the amp has pretty good parametric EQ control, so bringing home my SMAARTLIVE system from work I was able to dial everything in pretty nicely, and align the timing between boxes with precision!!! So I want to upgrade. I don't want a "whole new system" and with house and kids and working in the entertainment business and a house-mom for a wife, I don't have the budget for anything new!!! I was keeping my eyes peeled for a local deal on a KSF10.5. I seen a few deals on 8.5's but Im the type of guy who goes large or goes home when I deal with audio, so 10.5 what I'm looking for. I just came across a STEAL on a pair of RF-3's (original, not series 2) (under $200 for the pair!!!). I flirted with the idea of upgrading the series but the big question is if I upgrade the main L/R but not ATLEAST the center (which covers the bulk of sound) then will the tonal balance across the front sound stage be too different and not as pleasing as the lesser quality boxes with similar tonal balance across the system? My original plan was to get floor standing speakers for mains, and then "up"grade the current front KSB-1.1 to Front High speakers (or whatever they call that?) How different is the KSB's general tonal balance from the RF3's, and is it something the Aventage EQ woudnt be able to fix to an acceptable degree? Note that the system is MOSTLY used for general TV watching (by the family, I usually out working~) but occasionally I like to sit back and relax and let awesome sound surround and engulf me (until kids or wife ruin the zen experience!). Thank you for bearing with me (I have a hard time writing 2 sentence posts on these things!!!) and please if you have any ideas for me let me know, as I am anxious but hesitant at the same time to grab these RF3's... -AshayinFLA

No, it is the distance back from the plane of the speakers if you want a 60 degree spread. Think of this as a "maximum angle" before other problems arise (generally speaking). If you sit further back, then the angle decreases. I would not suggest going much below 45 degrees, or else you start losing out on the "stereophonic fun" I would certainly not advocate pulling the Klipschorns out of the corner (or false corner) Before you get too worried, with my jubilees I have a 60-70 degree spread and I am only sitting about 8 feet back from the plane of the speakers. I think folks sometimes get overly concerned about sitting too close.

After years of storage in an indoor closet, I must part with these beloved towers. They were my first 'real' purchase after getting my first 'real' job after college. I love them dearly. I love my wife more. She hates the size and looks of the pair. My wife is better looking in all respects, so I'll keep her. The RF-3s sound better though. One ding in one of the tweeters but still sounds great. Includes original feet and grills. Grills could use new netting. I can provide additional pictures. $300 for the pair.

No problem. Take your time and post when you want. This is more than a simple thread about speakers, you are dealing with the loss of your father. I know when I lost my father I had a hard time taking care of his business, it was just something I know I needed to do but I just didn't want to, if that makes any sense. When you are ready to deal with the speakers and would like some advice or support, we're here.

My head hurts............

Welcome to the Forums. I'm sorry to hear about the loss of your father and I'm glad you've decided to keep his La Scalas in the family. Tons of good advice directly upstream ^^^. My bottom line advice is ditch the current cheap speakers and run the La Scala's for TV. I would run them 2.0 for a while then add in the sub you already have for 2.1 so you can evaluate the speakers. They are highly sought after on the used market, you've got some good ones. Just plug them in and listen to them for a month or so. I'm glad you have some money to upgrade the system but after a month you'll have a better idea of what you want to hear. You might want another AVR, a lot of people will tell you to add a sub. I like a strong center speaker because for TV 90% of the sound is dialog, and 90% of the dialog comes out of the center speaker. Let's deal with the specifics of center speakers, subs, upgrades and other stuff in a month. For right now plug and play the La Scala's and enjoy them.

I did exactly that several years ago, and never looked back.

So very very tempting......

NICE!

That's really sad isn't it?

Like the skit, Klipsch marketing slaps "Heritage" on everything in attempt to instantly improve the item's appeal. (In my opinion)

You really should consider Word Perfect. It has spell check

Now he has increased the price up to $2000 each. Sheesh.... https://littlerock.craigslist.org/ele/d/klipsch-speaker-la-scala-and/6604758242.html

I think I remember the thread you're talking about. That was before Bob and I decided to experiment on the RF-3 II Crossovers. (I say we, but Bob did all the work, all I did was send him the old XO's.) Until then, there were no real XO mods/updates to the RF-3 design that I know of. I don't buy into auto-cal myself, so you won't see me complaining about your decision to opt to drop the idea of YPAO. Manual calibration has always been my cup of tea. You may or may not find the sweet spot between the KSB's and the RF's, but you might find it between other RB/C/F/S models. The closest relative of the RF-3 series that's not in the same family would be the 35 series. So if you're coming up empty handed on finding the identical matches, there are alternatives. I highly advise NOT getting the RC-3 that supposedly "goes" with the RF-3's. It struggles to perform, and is not at all similar to its successor models (35 and 62). Poke around in the garage sale section here, too. Good deals to be had. I think @opusk2k9 has a pair or two of RB-5's that would work well either as mains or surrounds and use the same 8" driver and 1" tweeter as the RF-3's.

ABSOLUTELY spot ON! Offensive scoring sells tickets but DEFENSIVE play wins Championships!

Crazy game tonight. I've never seen Thompson and Curry so cold. KD keeping them in it.

You stimulated a neuron firing with your posted pic of disc covers... I demastered a Chandos CD some time ago (The Black Knight...Elgar). The final demastering EQ curve turned out to be pretty wild--the worst that I remember seeing in a classical recording. Apparently I wasn't the only one that had issues with what I was hearing: https://www.amazon.com/product-reviews/B000000AYM/ref=acr_dpx_hist_3?ie=UTF8&filterByStar=three_star&showViewpoints=0 If they can do that to a CD, they can certainly do it to a multichannel SACD. I'd be skeptical of the as-mastered condition of that Rachmaninoff recording-especially choral--they uniformly roll-off the bass on choral recordings. I've also found the same problem, but with lesser magnitude, with Decca CDs and BDs, i.e., boosted harmonics above 1 kHz and rolled-off lows below 450 Hz. I've got a couple of ballet BDs that are a little difficult to listen to. I suppose that the practice of introducing significant levels of mastering EQ to classical tracks must be culturally acceptable in that locale. FYI only. Chris

P.S. There are of course also many multi-channel classical SACDs. Here's a few that I highly recommend: These classical SACDs sound fabulous with RF-7IIs in a surround-sound system, when driven by tube amps. (My Oppo UDP-205 universal disc player provides multi-channel pre-amp functionality, including bass management. No AVR needed.) Bottom line: Klipsch speakers and tube amps go together like peanut butter and jelly - particularly for classical music - including multi-channel SACD and Blu-ray.

I'm gonna put the Yamaha on there, you could always buy that

I know it always makes me act when I've been sitting on the fence about something. Heck for $260 I almost bought that UPA-500 from you!

Yup. I guess nevermind on the Emotiva gear. They both sold already. Not even up 2 hours. This 20% off sale helped out quite a bit.

@DizRotus Really? After all we have been through together, you assumed I thought the terminal cup was a second handle next to the "other" handle. You could give me a little more credit than that! Codewrittenfool was talking about one on each side as he clarified for you. On my splits the there is a handle on one side and the terminal cup on the other (that can be used to help move the top around if you need it) My terminal cup has the much preferred five way binding posts, not those cheap SpeakerOn connections! ( just trying to get a reaction out of you)

Torque sensor or rack.

I got a great big "Thank you Grandpa!!!" for sacrificing 4 AA batteries from my camera to put in granddaughter's toy. She doesn't know how I fixed the toy ... she just knows to bring it to me first.

LBJ likes Lue... He listens to him and works around LBJ, which would be hard for anyone to do w/LBJ's talent. Lue's a bobblehead and not much of a Coach. I still think he'll stay in Cleveland.

Maybe. But I've had claims with UPS and fedex before. I never got to keep the damaged goods.

I've seen them in a few klipschorns. I believe it was a customer choice.

I might be able to beat your "dumbazz" moment. It wasn't me, though, it was my brother. So about 30 years ago, my folks bought this piece of land next to theirs. My father and some of the other old-timers in the area remembered that there was a well-drilling rig on it in the late 1950's, and they all agreed on where it sat, plus or minus 30 feet or so. Dad wanted to find that well casing so he could mark it properly in case he ever wanted to use it. Well, one of my brothers knew someone with a "really good" metal detector that would make short work of finding the casing. So he borrowed it. It looked like a cheap unit to me, but what did I know? We all went over there to see if we could find it, and he goes into the approximate center of the designated area, fires the detector up, and starts sweeping the ground. Almost immediately he gets an indication of metal. Because I was the youngest brother, I got to man the shovel. So I started digging. I turned over a few shovel-fulls of dirt and he walks over and puts the detector in the hole. Nothing. He puts it on the pile of dirt. Nothing. Hmmm. That's odd. He starts sweeping again and gets another indication. It isn't over there, it is right here. Here I go with the shovel again, and once again, nothing. We do this whole process once more before I speak up and say, "Something is wrong. These holes are feet apart. There is no way you're getting detection in all of these places - you don't know how to work that thing and I'm not digging any more." Right then, Dad pointed to my brother's feet and started laughing. He had STEEL-TOED BOOTS on. Now *that's* a dumbazz (may they both R.I.P.)

Your lucky the battery did not blow up. Once I came out of a convenience store and as I walked past a truck the person went to start it and the battery blew up, it sounded like a shotgun going off and it dented the hood up in that spot 6"-8", it was quite surprising to the point that if I had need to go to the bathroom it would have been over with. I would think as most people you have been in the club a long time, this was just a reminder. Things like this happen to everyone sooner or later, or they are lying.

They are redoing it but i can't imagine they will ever sell badges, bad experiences, clowns putting them on knockoffs and other speakers trying to sell them off as Klipsch. If they do you would have to have a serial number off of your speaker, like with replacement parts.

I just think you have to give them some more time. I too am coming from klipsch Heresy 3's and at first I did not like the new forté. That changed dramaticaly after a couple of hundred hours of playing. I am very confident in saying that the Forte's need a lot of break in time. Now it is one of my favorite Klipsch speakers. I play them with tubes aswell with solid state amplifiers.

After getting off my lazy butt and doing a perfunctory search, I now realize I’ve confused Edroom with another veteran forum member, also named Ed. Nonetheless, Edroom is well known to the forum. I would not hesitate to pay $1,500 for these if closer and in the market. That said, I understand the desire for the assurance provided by photos. In my defense, the free hanging squirrel in Edroom’s avatar, reminded me of the other Ed who, reportedly, ran a nudist colony. If you bought Khorns from that Ed, cheek prints might be more of a concern than plant rings. 😊

As i sit here listening to my FIII, I cannot imagine what the OP must be hearing. All I experience is a full, detailed, room filling experience. These things image as well anything I have owned. And the tone and dynamics are incredible. I know horns are not for everyone. But if you like the original forte, I don't understand how you can't fall hard for these. Shakey

Delrin works well for stuff like this also. Strong, machines well, reasonably priced, clean, light, white or black, etc., etc..

--- or possibly bronze, bearing bronze specifically. Much higher resistance to corrosion, more expensive but a more industrial material as opposed to standard brass.